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JarrodG (Louisiana)
Posts: 16
Posted:
I bought one of nine lots in a beautiful subdivision where most of the area is common area. I do not plan on moving there for another couple of years until I pay off the land. We have and HOA meeting voming up to turn over the books from the developer to the residents. However, one of the residents had his friends buy 4 of the other lots and he owns two lots for a total of 6 of the 9 lots. He did this because the developer would not sell to him because they were in a lawsuit and he had not paid his HOA fees in two years for a total of about 5k. He did pay these rececently. The problem I see arising is now he has 2/3 vote on everything. Therefore, does he even have to ask me and the other homeowner? Obviously this guy wants power and control over the subdivision or he would not have gone through the trouble of buying the lots under different names (that is essentailly what he did). To clarify, there are 9 lot holders, each with one vote per lot. He has 6 of the 9 votes. I am just going to be at his mercy? How can he ever be opposed if he always have 2/3 of the votes? Thanks!
KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239
Posted:
I think your "gut reaction" to having one owner control 2/3's of the community is correct.

But, if the deeds aren't in his name for some of these properties, the "different names" would have to represent themselves tangibly. I'm not sure though.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Jarrod

The only thing you do know is he owns 2 of the 9 lots thus 2 of 9 votes. Do not be so sure he can control the others until things begin to happen. Might well be the place is run to your satisfaction.

I say wait and see.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
So did you want to be President? Look at it this way, atleast you won't be the one in the hot seat and responsible for everything. Plus it doesn't sound like he really does own the majority or will in the future. Sounds like he bought the lots to resale to other buyers to outsale the developer. My crystal ball predicts that those lots will go up for sale after the developer leaves. Which means new owners for those lots and them not owning the majority of the lots.

Plus just because one owns a majority of the lots does not mean they are automatically president. They may not want that position. It is up to you all to vote for the board members and then office positions. You could have a chance to be on your board or president just as much.

Former HOA President
JarrodG (Louisiana)
Posts: 16
Posted:
His friends bought the lots because the developer would not sell to him He has all of his friends proxy votes enabling him to vote on their behalf. He has been planning to own the lots for a couple of years so that he could have the majority votes. This is a fact that has been admitted by him. However, I do not know what his motive is exactly, I just get a bad feeling. I just want to know if my vote will ever count if he always 2/3 majority at all time? I appreciate everyones help and interest!
JonD1
Posts: 2,350
Posted:
Jarrod how long ago did these purchases occur?

How long have these individuals owed their lots?

Sounds to me the best you can do is wait ans see and understand if they paid for the lots just like you each owner gets their one vote.
JonD1
Posts: 2,350
Posted:
Jarrod how long ago did these purchases occur?

How long have these individuals owed their lots?

Sounds to me the best you can do is wait ans see and understand if they paid for the lots just like you each owner gets their one vote.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JarrodG on 03/07/2013 5:30 AM
Therefore, does he even have to ask me and the other homeowner?

Even though he has 6 of the 9 votes, he must still go through the proper procedures (notices, meetings, holding elections, etc.).

Quote:
Posted By JarrodG on 03/07/2013 5:30 AM
I am just going to be at his mercy?

For anything that is voted on by the membership, yes.
As you said, he controls 2/3rd of the votes. Therefore, for anything that requires a simple majority up to 2/3rds of the membership vote for something to be adopted/amended, then he has the votes (this is the same as if the developer was still in control of the Association).

However, for Board decisions, each member of the Board has one vote (regardless of how many lots they own). The authority and power of the Association is implemented by majority votes of the Board.

Granted, that individual, through his voting power, can control who gets elected to the board but he can only elect himself to one seat. Therefore, the other seats will be held by other owners.

Quote:
Posted By JarrodG on 03/07/2013 5:30 AM
How can he ever be opposed if he always have 2/3 of the votes? Thanks!

Become involved by serving on the Board and encourage your similar minded neighbors to serve on the Board with you. If there are 3 people on the board (that individual and two others) two people who have joined forces may join forces to make their votes the majority.

Also, many governing documents allow for the suspension of voting privileges/rights if an member has not paid their assessments. Since this individual is not paying assessments, then he can not cast a vote for any lot that is behind in the assessment. If he does, the results of the election can be challenged in court.
JarrodG (Louisiana)
Posts: 16
Posted:
The potential dictator personally purchased his house and one more lot 3yrs ago. Within the last year he has got his friends to buy four other lots. Again, he has gotten the written authority to vote for four of the other owners plus two votes (one for each lot he owns ) for himself. Therefore he has 6 of the 9 votes or 2/3%. Will I have any say so in any of the voting?
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JarrodG on 03/07/2013 6:58 AM

Will I have any say so in any of the voting?

Yes.

Will your desire for a vote go one way or the other will depend if your "say so" is persuasive enough to sway others to vote as you believe is the correct decision to whatever is being voted on.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Jarrod as Tim said your vote counts, just because things don't go your way, doesn't mean it doesn't count. Like being an independent in a democratic or republican district.

Do you have any idea what he wants the other lots for? He can only live in one home at a time so unless he intends to play musical houses, he intends to resell the lots, which renders your concerns mute. Of course he could intend to build rental properties on the lots or he wants a really big yard to maintain.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Jarrod

Did you ever consider he wants to raise the standard of the neighborhood?

You calling him a dictator says to me you two might have a history. Is this true?

JonD1
Posts: 2,350
Posted:
Jarrod:

Have you had any direct contact with any of these people including the "potential dictator"?

Just curious the price tag for one of these lots is ___________?

Is there a Board in place yet? Has any organization work been done?

While I understand your concern I just don't see any real fair option in this case. Each owner has one vote and IF these lot owners have granted this one person their voting rights just what might you suggest be done?

If you truly have a bad feeling about this all and see this going to wrong way for YOU perhaps you should contact this owner and offer to sell your lot before things go from bad to worse. If not sounds light a potential uphill battle for you down the road.
JarrodG (Louisiana)
Posts: 16
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnC46 on 03/07/2013 8:45 AM
Jarrod

Did you ever consider he wants to raise the standard of the neighborhood?

You calling him a dictator says to me you two might have a history. Is this true?


I probably should not have a prejudice against him but I do not have a history with with at all. I bought my lot 1 1/2 months ago and I do not have a house on there yet. The only experience i have with him is trying to introduce myself to him, twice. I did not get a good first impression. The other experience I have with him is only by talking to the other neighbor and the former hoa president ( the developer). He and the developer were in a law suit with a problem with his house with preempt him to stop paying his HOA dues (which he has now recently paid). His intention may be to raise the standards ,even though it is great condition, but I am just fearful that he may want to raise the standard according to want he thinks and not what me and the other owners think. The fact that he went through all the trouble and spent nearly $400K on the other lots indicates that he wants control over the whole area. Again, I just dont want to be living in "his" subdivision. I may be wrong about his motives but from the information I have gained, I doubt it. Please keep the advice and suggestions coming. thanks
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
No one can predict the future or what this person may do. However, you do have existing Convenants and Restrictions. Those will NOT change and can NOT change without a certain amount of owner votes. Which often takes 90% to 100% of the owners to agree to make those changes. So your restrictions can't change unless you all vote on them and take them to court to refile. So read your CC&R's since he's got to abide by those rules as well.

Don't confuse this with him or anyone else being president. The president/board members handle the every day operations of the HOA. The rules like the by-laws, CC&R's, and Articles of Incorporation tells them how to do that. Changes can be made to these documents NOT by one person but you all as the HOA.

So dictatorship may be in the everyday aspects but not overall in the restrictions. Those are written in stone until you all vote for changing and adapting.

Former HOA President
JarrodG (Louisiana)
Posts: 16
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 03/07/2013 9:13 AM
No one can predict the future or what this person may do. However, you do have existing Convenants and Restrictions. Those will NOT change and can NOT change without a certain amount of owner votes. Which often takes 90% to 100% of the owners to agree to make those changes. So your restrictions can't change unless you all vote on them and take them to court to refile. So read your CC&R's since he's got to abide by those rules as well.

Don't confuse this with him or anyone else being president. The president/board members handle the every day operations of the HOA. The rules like the by-laws, CC&R's, and Articles of Incorporation tells them how to do that. Changes can be made to these documents NOT by one person but you all as the HOA.

So dictatorship may be in the everyday aspects but not overall in the restrictions. Those are written in stone until you all vote for changing and adapting.

Thanks. I want to make sure I understand. He can appoint or vote the board members in then get their votes by proxy, right?
JarrodG (Louisiana)
Posts: 16
Posted:
Also, how to I obtain my CC&R? I have my hoa restrictions. Are these the same?
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
They are public documents at your local courthouse in the records department. The articles of incorporation are posted online somewhere on your state's website. The by-laws may or may not be filed. They are not required to be filed but may be with your CC&R's. Your HOA may have a Archectual Control Committee (ACC) that would have it's own paperwork and be internal. That is a separate committee separate from the board but the board does override them.

It depends if your president can assign board members or not. That would be in your documents on how elections are done and office positions assigned.

Former HOA President
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JarrodG on 03/07/2013 9:19 AM
I want to make sure I understand. He can appoint or vote the board members in then get their votes by proxy, right?

He may collect proxies (just as you can) and if he controls the votes at a general membership meeting he could control who is elected to the Board.

However, the Board makes the decisions for the Association and that is done by a majority vote of the Directors at a Board meeting. He may or may not have influence over the other directors but, typically, Directors may not vote by proxy at a Board meeting.
JulianneW (California)
Posts: 25
Posted:
You have my sympathies. I bought a home in an 8-home HOA and spent the first 5 years battling the developer, who continued to own 6 of the homes because of a market downturn. I was the only homeowner living in the community; the rest of the homes were rentals. It was a living nightmare and I finally refused to be on the board because I was powerless, anyway. Instead, I turned it around on the developer and demanded, as a member, that they enforce the CC&Rs in the development, but I had ton constantly threaten lawsuit to get anything done.

I will never EVER buy another property in such a small HOA again. Ever.

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