Tie vote on a motion

Started by LindaC3 • 10 replies • 1470 views

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LindaC3 (Florida)
Posts: 526

Posted:

Good day group....needing some input about tie voting........We have a 13 Member BOD..... At out last BOD meeting a motion was made to allow RV'S to be parked on the Members lot with lanscaping being used asan effective means of screening..... The motion came to a vote :::: 6 for the landscaping 6 against... The President abstained from voting..... We were told that the motion failed.... Can someone please explain how the motion failed if it was a tie vote and no vote from the President ??? I was under the assumption that in the case of a tie the Prez had to vote to break the tie....All comments are so welcomed.....LindaC

RonaldW (South Carolina)
Posts: 901

Posted:

I would say that a tie vote doesn't pass a change in rules, they stay the same. I don't believe anyone can be forced to vote. Perhaps the president had no opinion one way or the other.

I would ask all the board members to think about it again, ask the members for their input (no, I don't mean put it to a vote, just ask around to get a general feeling) and bring it up again.

If the cost of the landscaping is an issue, consider charging a nominal fee for RV storage on the lot to cover the cost.

Ron
SC

RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067

Posted:

Linda, first I would presume this deals with a restriction in the Covenants and therefore a vote by the Board would have no authority except possibly to clarify the restriction. To answer your question, the Chair does not have to vote to break the tie. In your example the motion failed because there is not a majority in favor when the vote is 6 yea, 6 nea, and 1 absention.

JanM (Texas)
Posts: 142

Posted:

I always thought that the president WAS the tie breaker and that is the only reason he would vote on a motion...at least in our HOA he is.

RonaldW (South Carolina)
Posts: 901

Posted:

Posted By JanM on 03/04/2007 7:23 AM

I always thought that the president WAS the tie breaker and that is the only reason he would vote on a motion...at least in our HOA he is.

In ours, all the board members are entitled (but not required) to vote.

Ron
SC

RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067

Posted:

Jan, in small groups, such as a Board, the President can vote on any issue when following Robert's Rules of Order. They are not restricted to only voting when there is a tie. And when they only vote to bread a tie they can abstain which means the motion does not pass. Also, any other Board member may abstain on any motion.

LindaC3 (Florida)
Posts: 526

Posted:

Good Day Group--- Does anyone know if when a motion fails due to a tie- and the RULE passed violates the Deed Restrcitions --- Are the homeowners allowed to petition the BOD to revisit the RULE due to the fact it violates the Deed Restricitons..... LindaC

WilliamT (Arizona)
Posts: 489

Posted:

Posted By LindaC3 on 03/05/2007 4:40 AM

Good Day Group--- Does anyone know if when a motion fails due to a tie- and the RULE passed violates the Deed Restrcitions --- Are the homeowners allowed to petition the BOD to revisit the RULE due to the fact it violates the Deed Restricitons..... LindaC

Homeowners can petition anything they want. That doesn't mean they'll get the results they desire.

What is the exact wording of the deed restriction, and the wording of the rule? It's much easier for members of this forum to help if you provide the detailed information.

RonaldW (South Carolina)
Posts: 901

Posted:

Are we talking about a private lot belonging to a homeowner or is this a lot that belongs to the HOA?

After rereading the original post and my first reply, I realize that I may have missunderstood. If someone wants to park an RV on his lot and it's a violation of the deed restrictions, I don't think the board can make an exception, at least not if the CC&Rs are like ours. The CC&Rs would have to be ammended. If there's a parking lot belonging to the community then they would probably be allowed to make or change rules that apply to the parking lot.

Ron
SC

LindaC3 (Florida)
Posts: 526

Posted:

(I) "Temporary Residence" means a mobile residence including, without limitation, a mobile home, a trailer intended for human occupancy, a motor home or a camper. THIS IS A DEFINITION FROM OUR DEED RESTRICTIONS

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Section 6. No Temporary Residence is permitted on a Residential Lot except as may be temporarily permitted by a Rule of general application and which shall be subject to applicable laws and ordinances. THIS IS FROM THE DEED RESTRICITONS--- SO you see ,no RV is allowed on the property--- BUT...they made a Rule that says you can keep it there if you build a LARGE UGLY building to store it in--- BUT - having the RV on the property is only TEMPORARY...The Building will be there for forever.....Some of us feel the rule violates the Restrictions....We have 3 acre parcels and the County Codes says you are allowed to park them on the property w/o being in a building provided they have current registration and tags...Now others feel that the Section 6 "general rule" doesn't specifically permit the BOD to make a Rule....They feel that the "general" rule would be the County Rule already in place that permits RV'S to be parked on the property..COMMENTS ???

Section 7. Subject to applicable laws, ordinances and the Rules, camping is permitted on a Residential Lot. THIS IS ALSO IN OUR DEED RESTRICTIONS..........Why you ask.....well the County PROHIBITS camping on residential lots....So back in 1999 without telling the residents that we were violating the law by camping- Our then Prez went and applied for a special exception....I accidentally found some paperwork in my Sisters closing paperwork and went to the County and they dug up the file for me and made copies...I was shocked .....So now the BOD is telling everyone that the camping Rule is their rule....I've been telling people no it is not....It is a RULE FROM THE COUNTY because for years we were in violation of the County Codes every time we set up our campgrounds on our property...

This situation has escalated into a MAJOR division within the Community.....It's absolutely disgusting how these people are acting towards one another ...And we are talking about PRIVATE MOTOR COACHES....you know -- the $300,000.00 plus ones...not tin can looking things......

I am just looking for some guidance from the group as how to handle this situation before it goes any further...Personally I dont give a rats patute if they parked on the lot or not--- We have 3 acres of lands filled with trees and buffers....As long as they dont park them in plain sight i say let them have them.....I'd rather see and RV that can be moved than a 40 x 40 x a6 ft tall PERMANENT building any day....Thanks for all your comments...LindaC

WilliamT (Arizona)
Posts: 489

Posted:

As I see the situation, these are upscale RV's and are not used as a temporary residence. That is, no one is residing on them on the property. I believe the RV owners are just storing the RV on the property. So you would look to see if there is a section dealing with RV or trailer "storage".

It seems that the community may need to get a committee together to work this through. Perhaps a committe consisting of three who are pro on the subject and 3 who are con, and a chairperson who is neutral, and has some experience in sort of mediating so s/he can guide the committee to arrive at a recommendation for the board that will have some middle ground acceptable for the community.

In this particular case, I believe that each side of the issue may need to give a little. If everyone takes a hard line, then it's difficult to work out a solution.

You may need to ask the board to have an attorney read the CC&R's and write a legal opinion of the sections that deal with "temporary residence" and whether that applies to "RV storage". The attorney can also see if the CC&R's allow the construction of a building to house an RV.

Having an attorney work out these issue will help the community to work out their differences. But I believe it should be an HOA specialist who is hired by the board. The attorney will understand that s/he needs to interpret the CC&R's according to the law, and perhaps help the board to develop Rules that will not be in conflict with the applicable CC&R.

Good luck on this

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