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RickR1 (California)
Posts: 37
Posted:
A member is having trouble paying his dues and we haven't said anything about it in our annual meeting. What is the proper way to deal with a member who needs a little time to get his finances in order? Do we suspend his ammenities like a normal homeowner? Take him off the board?

Thanks
JamesC (Maryland)
Posts: 282
Posted:
Rick:
To serve on our board, a member MUST be in good standing. Behind in your assessements is not a member in good standings.
At each of our monthly meetings the MC rep either brings, or sends the financial reports to the bod members via email two days before the meetings.
As a member of your board, this member must know they are not setting a good example to the other homeowners.
On another post we have been addressing the issue of not being able to collect past assessements.
Two of my own neighbors have asked me why they should pay, if others are not.
Imagine living in your community and having a board member being in default.
If they are experiencing some temporary financial difficulty I would attempt to allow them to make partial payments, until they are able to get back on their feet.
Otherwise?????????????????????????????????????????????

Jim
BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640
Posted:
Rick:

This is what I would do, it sounds like he is willing to pay but is having trouble with finances right now. I would suspend his amenities as you would with any other homeowner and I would temporarily suspend him from the board until he can get things in line. I would give him a timeframe, say 3 months or so to get back in good standing or ask him to resign his position. I think we are all hard up for volunteers so I wouldn't run him off, but at the same time I do agree that board members should be held to a higher standard.

I see no reason to make a spectacle out of it either, treat him like any other homeowner would be treated IMO.
RonaldW (South Carolina)
Posts: 901
Posted:
Chances are, this person is putting his HOA assessment at the bottom of the list of bills to be paid. Below the mortgage, car payments, utilities, etc. The reason is, he feels there is less to loose by not paying these assessments than by not paying the other bills.

An HOA should not be a charitable organization, nor should it be a money lending institution. If he doesn't have the funds right now to pay his assessments he should borrow from a bank, not the HOA.

The statement about being a member in good standing to be a board member may or may not be correct in your association. You need to check the bylaws. On the other hand, being in default and being on the board is not a good situation. How can the board ask members to pay their assessments when one of the board members is not paying his. I would say he pays up or is asked to resign. If you suspend him, you may have to tell the members the reason for the suspension.

Ron
SC
WilliamT (Arizona)
Posts: 489
Posted:
If this person has been a good productive board member, then I suggest talking to him privately, perhaps in closed session, to see what is the problem. Try to work someithing out so that everyone wins. A good board member is hard to find.

Don't suspend his amenities. Remember that board members put in a lot of hours without compensation, and while they should be treated equally as far as compliance is concerned, if they are having a hard time, perhaps the board can bend just a little bit to help this person through a difficult period. I would treat it as I would a family whose husband is in Iraq and they are falling on some difficult financial times; with compassion.
JamesD3 (Florida)
Posts: 6
Posted:
Our member resigned from the Board. However, a member of the Board MUST be up to date with all payments and hve no violations or other problems.
RickR1 (California)
Posts: 37
Posted:
The board member in question is behind on his dues but I totally forgot to bring it up in the exect. session meeting. The M.C. didn't seem to care too much to remind me.
Any way, this board member has been handleing owners and violations badly. A few complaints and now its showing in the meeting where arguements start on his account. I like the idea of taking him off t he board until the finances are inorder.
PaulM (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 1,347
Posted:
RickR1:
I would caution you to be sensitive when 'removing' this Board member;
you would not want it to be stated that he is remiss in his dues (do unto others...) But, the Board could state that for personal reasons this member must withdraw temporarily (as you say, taking him off until his finances are in order) and you will be naming a Board member to his seat until he returns.
In this case, I would expect you could 'name' an interim board member.
As for his wrong handling of owners and violations, that's unfortunate but could be a result of the personal financial pressure he is under. Let us know what happens.
PaulM
JanM (Texas)
Posts: 142
Posted:
A board member would not hesitate to suspend a members priviledges if they were behind on dues, so why should he get preferential treatment just because he is on the board? He is still a member of the HOA and must abide by the rules just like everyone else.
KathyS (California)
Posts: 145
Posted:
I agree with JanM. Why should a Board member get special treatment?
JulieS (Georgia)
Posts: 412
Posted:
I would bring the issue up in an executive session. Remind him that board members must be in good standing to serve on the board. As like any homeowner, he could submit a written request for a payment plan and the board vote on it. If accepted and payments made as agreed, then he could be back in good standing.

Someone stated that this person probably has his HOA dues at the bottom of the list for payment because he does not have anything to lose. I disagree with this statement as everyone on the board knows that he is behind and could risk members of the community finding out. It could be that the issues in the meetings resulting from his behavior has to do with him feeling embarrassed, etc.

I recommend talking to him and going from there.
RonaldW (South Carolina)
Posts: 901
Posted:
Posted By JulieS on 03/04/2007 8:02 AM

Someone stated that this person probably has his HOA dues at the bottom of the list for payment because he does not have anything to lose. I disagree with this statement as everyone on the board knows that he is behind and could risk members of the community finding out.


It was me and I said "less" to loose. Don't pay your mortgage and you loose the house. Don't pay the car payments and you loose the cars. Don't pay utility bills and your power and water are cut off. Don't pay your HOA assessments and you get a letter. Possibly a penalty or fine. Loose the use of the swimming pool (if there even is one). Eventually you will probably have to pay. In the meantime, the HOA becomes a bank, "lending" him the money.


Ron
SC
CharlesW1 (Georgia)
Posts: 826
Posted:
Posted By JanM on 03/04/2007 7:07 AM

A board member would not hesitate to suspend a members priviledges if they were behind on dues, so why should he get preferential treatment just because he is on the board? He is still a member of the HOA and must abide by the rules just like everyone else.


I have yet to read any further, but I would have to agree with JanM’s post completely. I do agree (as posted earlier) he is probably having financial hardships, but he is supposed to be setting an example for the entire community. It discusses me to even see that you are asking and even more disturbing that he hasn’t suggesting resigning or at least making some sort of payment arrangements until he is current! What kind of example is the board setting when (because he is a board member) he doesn’t lose his amenity privileges? I’m sure any other member that is delinquent in their assessments, certainly would!

I personally would approach him and discuss his situation, making him aware that ALL board members must be current on the assessment/dues and that the board feels that it would be best to suspend his use of the amenities, while offering him a payment arrangement. I would inform him that the board could remove him completely, but being a “board member” you would like to help you any way we can.

IMO, I feel it would be wrong of the board to do absolutely nothing! I hope he, you and the board do what’s best for your community association.

Best of luck,
Chuck W.


Charles E. Wafer Jr.
RickR1 (California)
Posts: 37
Posted:
I talked to the manage co. and he was suspose to send in a payment plan and basically tell them how much he can pay & or when he thinks he will be able to catch up with the dues. He didn't do this yes so they will ask him again. If this goes unanswered or if it slipped his mind then a letter from the MC will go to the board explaining the situation and the what nots. From here we can decide what happens.
Thanks for all of your posts and advice. We definately want to add compassion to this issue but business is business. He is treated no differently than any other homeowner. They will get the same treatment.
DouglassN (Illinois)
Posts: 1
Posted:
Why is the guy behind on his dues? A sick wife?, a kid with problems? Did he catch a bad break?

Getting out the million pound dung hammer is not the way to start off solving the problem. As a neighbor, I would be inclined to throw in with some other residents and help him out, rather than add to his problems.

Douglass G. Norvell, Ph.D.
BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640
Posted:
Douglass:

First of all it would be very unethical for any member of the board to make it know that this person was behind in dues, therefore unless this person asked for help from neighbors it is highly unlikely that you would know and be in a position to hep out.

You ask some good questions, a good board would ask the same things and work with this guy to help him out. You also have to remember that when a board member is behind on dues it then becomes hypocritical of the board to ask all other homeowners to pay up.

I agree with you to give him the benefit of the doubt, but most of us are too proud to ask for help so his neighbors would never know he was in that situation. Unless they decide to disclose that it should remain that way. When we talk about delinquent homeowners we never mention names or addresses at the open part of the board meeting, privacy is a big concern for me.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I started out with 7 board members one year. 4 of them moved out, 1 went to Iraq, 1 went into a nursing home, and 1 was the one behind on their dues. We ONLY had elections ONCE a year! The last 3 months of my Presidency I moved out!!!
My only choice was to keep the Vice-President in office despite him NOT paying his dues. (He was on a heart transplant list). It was a well-known fact that he was behind in his dues. However, it wasn't due to health issues it was his way of "Protesting". His kitchen would flood everytime it rained. The developer was long gone making the HOA responsible for fixing flooding issues. Unfornately, he was about third on the list for MAJOR repairs. He had voted to allow the 2 other homes to get repaired because they flooded about 4 feet in the rain. When it came to his "turn" the HOA no longer could afford to do the work. So I can understand why he "protested" by not paying. I didn't hold it against him but it sure didn't help any. Without him, I would have been the ONLY person running the HOA!!!
I believe everyone gets behind on their dues once and awhile for every reason in the book. That is why we put a 6 months and then we lien policy into place. I wouldn't consider a member NOT in good standing if they had NOT reached the 6 month mark or that amount of money owed. Usually, I would request that the person behind DOUBLE their dues payment when they are able to "catch-up" sans the late fee. If they owed us $200 (that's 4 months dues) I would request they pay $100. Normal dues are $50 a month with a $20 late fee. It would allow them to catch up faster and us receive the money. It was a good compromise. Otherwise, it just becomes a situation where it is "threatening" and people don't respond well to that. I also kept the reasons under discretion unless it was blatant disregard they weren't paying.

Former HOA President
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Melissa, why are you saying I rather than the Board? I believe you mean to say the association started with 7 Board members and the Board used discretion.

My question is why didn't the Board appoint replacements to fill vacancies on the Board as members resigned? There is no reason to wait for another members meeting unless the By-laws do not allow appointments to fill vacanies. In which case the association needs to amend their By-laws to allow this.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Our rules didn't allow appointments. Plus I was basically the only one on the board! It would have looked "unfair" if I were to personally picked someone. It took us over 2 years and $1700 to ammend the rules the first time around and that was for an address change and water meter reference!
Our HOA was okay with me running the place. What I lacked in board members I didn't lack in other homeowner's opinions. I just used the people who were interested and attended most of the meetings opinions. Even though I couldn't put them on the board, I could atleast use their input.
Lucky for me, I ran the HOA so well that I quickly had a group of new board and officers to replace me. Can't be complimented more than encouraging a group to want to kick you out and take over considering for 3 years I couldn't get but 5 people to attend a meeting! The new board that took over quickly destroyed the HOA completely but atleast I wasn't stuck running the place by myself for years.

Former HOA President
JM2 (Oregon)
Posts: 439
Posted:
Hi Rick:

I'm not sure what your documents say...that's where I would look first for guidance. If it's clear in the CC&R's or Bylaws, then you need to proceed accordingly. If not...

If he's having trouble paying dues and is causing problems at board meetings (perhaps a bit stressed over finances?) then maybe just talking to him (either at his house or at a neutral place) would be in order; keep to the facts (behind on dues, seems to be stressed, etc.) and ask him if he needs to resign his position at this point, until he can get finances in order. He may want to stay in office - if so, you can use this as leverage to help motivate him to get paid up... but he may be waiting for an invitation to step down. Let him know that people step down from Boards for all kinds of reasons and there's no shame in doing so.

He may be up to his neck (or higher) with bills and need to sell the house before the situation eats him up (report today, foreclosures are up 47% in March 2007 over March 2006...).

JPM
RandalR (Tennessee)
Posts: 98
Posted:
Our dues are set and due in January of each year but the previous Board President (the attorney no less) declared that he would pay them when he was "damn good and ready!" That turned out to be July! Knew he could bully most of the other Board members and did.

Board members should be among the first to pay their dues but one again most Bylaws are silent on specifics like this and you're relying on what would be considered "best business practices", which are also not enforceable. On a true hardship case I would agree with Brad. Give them a timeframe in which to get current or allow them to graciously and quietly resign.
RonaldW (South Carolina)
Posts: 901
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RickR1 on 03/03/2007 8:41 AM
A member is having trouble paying his dues and we haven't said anything about it in our annual meeting. What is the proper way to deal with a member who needs a little time to get his finances in order? Do we suspend his ammenities like a normal homeowner? Take him off the board?

Thanks

I believe you have to treat him like any other homeowner. Board members should not have special priveleges.

Ron
SC
RonaldW (South Carolina)
Posts: 901
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DouglassN on 04/22/2007 3:22 PM
Why is the guy behind on his dues? A sick wife?, a kid with problems? Did he catch a bad break?

Getting out the million pound dung hammer is not the way to start off solving the problem. As a neighbor, I would be inclined to throw in with some other residents and help him out, rather than add to his problems.

Douglass G. Norvell, Ph.D.

If the neighbors (as individuals) want to help him pay his dues, that's fine but the association should not be paying or forgiving his payments or late fees.

It would be unfair for the association to forgive his debts unless it is willing to forgive everyone's debts. And of course, it could not continue to operate if it did this.

Ron
SC
GloriaM (North Carolina)
Posts: 829
Posted:
Is giving someone a payment plan special treatment? If you can work out a forebearance agreement with an Owner, why not allow your fellow board member that same right.

In our topsey turvey world today he could have many good reasons for having money problems. I would suggest the humane thing would be to find out what his problem is and work with him to pay his dues off. We all get into a bind and need a little help.

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