Mutiny in the suburbs

Hi everyone,

I wasn't sure what kind of subject to give this topic -- so I went with comical. I'm hoping you'll read it and offer your thoughts/ideas/expertise/corny jokes.

When I came onto the new board, I was told about a lease administration program that our property management company wanted to implement. They have done this at other communities and they wanted to have it across the board. Our previous board had approved it. The gist of the whole thing is that they want to charge $10/month to any homeowner who rents his property to a non-family member to cover the additional administrative costs of mailing two of everything and hunting down people who live off-site when something goes wrong. That part I understand completely. Not to mention that we need to keep up an accurate record of who is living in our property.

They sent everyone a form asking them to classify their home as owner-occupied, owner's second residence or rental property. From that, they will determine which folks to follow up with as far as fees, copies of leases, etc. That also seems fair, although several homeowners do not feel the same way about it. We do need this information for violations and mortgage underwriters.

The next part is where it gets sticky. They want an accounting of everyone living in each residence, even if it is owner-occupied. I understand to some extent, but I have some very unhappy homeowners. First, folks who have roommates are worried they are paying the administrative fee (they are not) and secondly, folks feel like we are too much in their business. Even I personally plan to give them the names of my roommates, but I am not giving them any of their contact info except for their license plate numbers for parking stickers (which is a whole 'nother issue). My roommates should not be contacted about HOA issues, but if there were a fire, it'd be nice if they could tell the firemen that three people live there.

We are having a bit of a mutiny. Folks are saying that they aren't filling it out. Others have indicated they are just going to lie. Our folks are big fans in civil disobedience when they don't like new rules.

Anyhow, what I really wanted to ask all of you guys is: how much do you know about your homeowners? Do you know who lives with them? Who's renting or who's occupying their unit? I know part of it is just being neighborly, but with 236 units it's hard to know everyone personally (although I am working on it).

Questions:

Who keeps that $10 per rental per month? The management company or the Association?

As this is effectively an additional assessment for non-resident members, will this be in compliant with your CC&Rs (as most specify how the lots/units will be accessed - equally, percentage, square feet, etc.)

"Not to mention that we need to keep up an accurate record of who is living in our property. . . . We do need this information for violations and mortgage underwriters" - No you don't. You need to know the members and their mailing address. If the mailing address is not the same as the lot/unit then consider it rented.

"They want an accounting of everyone living in each residence." Why? What purpose does it serve the Association? What authority (law, governing document) does the Association have for having such an accounting? If you don't have the authority, you can't demand it.

Now for your Questions:

how much do you know about your homeowners?
As an individual I know the names of most of the residents on my block (i.e. my neighbors). With a few of the neighbors I know some personal info as we have become friends.

As Treasurer of the Association - I know the members mailing address and if they are current on paying assessments. As a member of the Board - I know if they are currently in violation of any covenants. That's all I really need to know.

Do you know who lives with them? For those I call friends yes. For the majority of the development/membership - No.

Who's renting or who's occupying their unit?
If the unit is being rented - Yes (based on mailing address of member)
Who is renting it - No. The Association is not involved in the rental process and, at least for my Association, has no authority to be involved.

I know part of it is just being neighborly, but with 236 units it's hard to know everyone personally (although I am working on it). Knowing your neighbors is being neighborly. Maintaining a membership is complying with State laws. Having you know who is or isn't living with me is, honestly, none of your business.

I see good things and bad things with this system. It is one of those ideas with good intentions but the practice not so much. First off, regardless of where an owner lives the HOA is to use the HOA address to send correspondence to. So if your doubling your notifications one should be the certified mail address and the other a courtesy US mail copy. Not that expensive. Plus the owner on record is free information. It's on file at the Tax Assessor's office. It may not be 100% up to date due to how recent the sales is, but it is indicative of who the owner is. Just need their lot # to find that out.

Yes, it is important for the mortgage companies to know the number of renters versus owners. This does indeed effect the type, interest rate, and qualification for loans. This topic has been covered several times and it's best to go look up some of those previous postings. It is a PUD/HUD form that the federal government backed loans usually use to gauge the health of the HOA. They do have a rental cap.

It seems the management company has found a way to make charges for something that is mostly free information. It's kind of like credit protection companies charging money to "protect" your credit when it is free to get a copy of your credit report each year and put a fraud alert on it.

What I knew about each lot in my HOA came more organically and by meet and greets. I would walk my neighborhood with my dogs and talk to people. Our open meetings people also kept everyone informed of what they knew. It wasn't being nosy but if you observe a house is empty long enough someone is going to bring it up in conversation. If you want to know something then you go and do the work to find out. Don't depend on your Property Management as they are the SUB contractors to your HOA who is to be doing whatever the HOA board tells them to do. NOT the other way around.

So, what we really have is two bigger issues:
1. The previous board (which was a little more hands-on than we are, to beat around the bush) has authorized the management company to enact this policy which the management company is trying to implement at all of the communities they work with.
2. I like the management company and I like our PM. I think they do a good job. However, I have been putting out fires for the last 24 hours about this program, and it's very clear that our homeowners are not on board with it. I don't think any of us want to move to a new company, but what if it truly is a deal-breaker for them.

I would love to just send things to the address of the property, but if we did that we'd probably see even less dues and fine money than we do now. Not to mention we'd never get rid of the curtains made out of bed sheets thrown over a rod.

You say they (old BOD and present management company) plus imply you are on the present BOD. The old BOD is gone and the management company works for the present BOD which you are a member of.

Tough love here. Either lead, follow, or get out of the way.

Tim makes some excellent points. Does the BoD have the authority to essentially create a new assessment simply because the management company wants to charge ten bucks to properties in the community that are rentals? I would also think that if it is within the powers of the HOA to charge this assessment, it would seem a bit selective and unfair charging some property owners but not others on the basis of where they reside.

I also think that having the names of not just the property owners but every inhabitant of the neighborhood is a bit too much.

I have no issues with an HOA (thus the property manager) having the names, addresses, phone numbers of each owner (even if not in residence) and the owner providing the same about anyone renting their unit.

Much information beyond that I could have issues with.

My issue with the OP was I felt their Property Manager might be controlling the BOD versus the other way about if under owner control.

I consider one of the duties/obligations of a BOD is they be able easily locate the unit owner/renter/resident. I also believe most Covenants give the BOD the right to maintain an up to date list of such.