Does the HOA's property management company have a right to enter my unit?

I got a notice in the mail that stated that the HOA's property management company is scheduled to enter the unit to check for water leaks. All the homeowner's received this notice. The notice states that entry is required and mandatory. The water is paid for out of HOA funds as a collective whole for everybody. Do they have a right to enter? Do I have to let them in?

Because its not their house. And most of the people living here don't like them after their loss of over $20,000... Long story on that one having to do with the past president stealing money from the account. He was later busted and was red red by courts to pay back a large portion. Anyway, it's not their house. Most of us don't want them coming near our homes. They are real crooks.

Ariel,

If you are in a condo, the association is responsible for not only the costs of the water but may also be responsible for damage caused by water leaks. Most homeowner insurance will not pay for damage done by leaks and it is doubtful that the association's policy would provide coverage against that damage. My first guess would be that the association has some reason to believe that there are leaks already.

Depending on a lot of variables, the notice should give you a date when the inspection will occur. If you are concerned, arrange to be there when they show up.

Do they have keys to your unit? If so, it seems a little odd to be worried that the management company would develop sticky fingers when they enter after giving you notice. They can make entry at any time without giving notice if they want to steal.

Here is a reality check for you...You stated that your HOA pays the water bill using the dues money it collects correct? So let us say there is a leak. You don't allow them in or another member doesn't. The leak continues and the HOA gets a bill for 1K from the water department. I will tell you from my own HOA experience a water bill from a leak can go into several thousand dollars if not corrected but keeping it simple at 1K as an example. (We've had leak bills of 5K to 20K for the leak and repair)

Let's say your normal HOA water bill is around $500. That is the amount of money your HOA budgets each month to pay. That extra $500 has to be paid out of the dues. Which means if your HOA has a close budget then it may have to have a special assessment or raise your dues to cover the extra cost of the leak. In other words, expect you and your neighbors to start paying a larger chunk of money because the HOA wasn't able to have access to fix the problem. Does that sound very fair to you?

Seriously, get over the whole thing. It's important access for utilities and emergencies is granted. They are decent enough to give you notice and probably make arrangements for you to be there. I don't think the HOA is crossing any lines or not holding up it's end of the bargain by doing this. It sounds responsible and the right thing to do.

I've lived at this place for over 10 yrs. This entry request, actually demand, has never occurred in all my yrs here. We really think that one of our neighbors has a dispute with the HOA board, and they are just looking at reasons to tuner her home. I really don't care if they want to nspect her home or not. I just don't want them in mine, and neither some other residents I spoke with.

The last president was ordered to resign after it was found he stole over $20,000 from the HOA account. He blamed it on the property manager. The property manager is still managing the HOA, and many of us don't like the guy because we feel he was also involved with the past embezzlement. He has used his position to boss people around and threaten fines, liens, etc on other homeowners for illegitimate reasons. There are many of us not wanting this guy in our homes for any reasons.

No where in our covenants does it state that the HOA board or its manager has a right to enter an individual owner's house. I just don't want the guy coming in acting like he's there checking for water leaks, and then fines us for something dumb like us having too many cars parked out front.

No one gives a crap about your dirty underwear on the floor or growing pot in the closets. It's time for you all to grow up. Sorry but when it comes to water leaks or utility issues in your place that can effect everyone, suck it up. It's NOT about you and it's not about your neighbors. It's about making sure your property is fit to be sold to the next person who wants to buy. Imagine when the first of your unit owners wants to sell their property just to find out the mold inspection failed due to a water leak in the unit next door that won't let people in?

You are all doing damage to yourselves in the end just because it's never been done before doesn't mean it doesn't need done. I think the HOA is taking the proper steps and giving you all a notice. Let them do their job and then complain if they do something else other than give you water saving advice or inform you that you have a leak to be repaired.

Thanks. I think, although we have a board, we are declarant controlled in that the contract reveals that the President has the power to make decisions without board approval.

I did go over all the covenants more thoroughly, and I did see something about notice requests to enter homes. So, I guess I found the line in the covenants that supports the HOA to enter the home for a valid reason. I suppose I am going to let the jerk in my house. I'm not going to like it. I don't think he would steal anything. He's not a crook in that sense. He's more of the white-collar kinda crook who would do some other shady stuff to the accounting books.

Looks like I am going to let this guy into my home. Too bad legally, I don't think I can stop him.

I think I am going to reluctantly let them in, though I don't want too. I rechecked our covenants and I think they are similar to yours. It states that they can enter if they feel their is an emergent need. The notice we were given is to check for leaks in each and every one of our homes. There are about 120 homes in our HOA. It's weird. I mean. WHat is so "emergent" about checking leaks in all of our homes?

Hey Jon, you don't know enough of our situation to be taking what I am saying and coming up with the comment that my concerns are anything less than valid.

Ariel, it might help to look at this inspection from a purely financial perspective. With 120 homes, you probably have at least 240 toilets, maybe a lot more. Many folks are really lazy about replacing toilet tank flappers and a leaky toilet can waste an amazing amount of your money.

I assume, too, that you can attend a Board meeting and ask why this inspection is being done.

And I agree with just about everyone else who's replied. Let them in--we have a couple of mandatory inspections inside of our condo units every year and I'm very glad that we do.

Yeah, I am going to let the guy in. A lot of us aren't happy about it. I made a bad example about him nosing around looking for parking violations. And the guy Jon railed on that poor example. I don't want Mr. Property Manager over because he is truly a vile, despicable person who not many people in our HOA like. He has threatened and harassed many people in the community we live in. He has been complained about by other homeowners about him yelling at the neighborhood kids for leaving their bikes outside. He also plays his stupid neighborhood watchdog cop guy. No joke. Some of us even did a search for his name and saw his mugshot online. So, no it's not merely an issue of him nosing around looking for cars. In any case, if I and others could keep him out we would.

Board meetings are closed and are for our HOA board only. Other homeowners are not allowed. We know its not fair, but no one wants to fight it. I certainly don't. I'm just going to go along with his notice to do his so-called inspection. I assume that most of our other neighbors are too. But really though, I don't like it. But, don't want any trouble either. So, I suppose if he has an even halfway valid reason for entry, then I suppose I am going to go along with it.

If you refuse, they could simply shut your water off to see if its your house that is leaking. And maybe in the next month or two, get someone to fix it and maybe turn it back on. Or.... you could just let them in.

I posted earlier and said you and your co-residents had to much time on your hands....use that time, attend meetings, get yourself or one of your co-residents (or more)elected to the board....you don't like the the Management Company....change companies...IT CAN BE DONE.....

The board I'm on is currently replaceing a roof on a home that had a leak around roof vent that resulted in "mold" in the walls in the kitchen.....we cover all outside maintance so it is our HOA responsibility. If u think you have trouble, wait for the first discovery of mold..

My last post on this subject...the ball is in your court....DO SOMETHIMG WITH IT!!

I know that Ariel says they're declarant controlled, but I'm not sure that's correct. She seems to use the words declarant and president interchangeably. Possible they're one and the same.

So, Ariel, are you saying that the developer who built your HOA is still in control? After 10 years? And you're also saying that TX law allows all HOA Board meeting to be closed to Owners?

Owners should really have seperate water meters. Without meters, if you have a water leak and its shared between 200 people, your share is $2 and $15 increase in sewer bills. But if you have your own meter, you notice your water bill goes up $100 and sewer bill $500. That makes people take notice and fix the leak.

Which is what the HOA is doing right now. They probably noticed a sudden increase in bills.

Well, I hope that I don't sound mean now, but you and your neighbors must make it your business to learn if it's legal to have CLOSED HOA board meetings in TX.

If your PM is as dreadful as you say, gather your neighbors together and send a certified letter to the Board demanding change. You and others in yur HOA need to spend some time learning your rights. It's much bettr than griping and not taking any informed action.

Jon, pls stop twisting my words. Just leave me alone. I admit that I have been naive to HOA terminology and not as well-versed with this type of information as you. I sought help. I have been humiliated and embarrassed for my lack of knowledge. I don't need you jumping on the pile with your lecturing and patronizing words.

Carol, thanks for the advice. We have learned that it is illegal to have closed meetings, but we were told that management, aka HOA board meetings... I thnk they don't want to call them board meetings, but that's what they are. Anyways, these management/board meetings are closed meetings because the HOA board meets with the Property Manager to discuss how the money is being spent. They vote on expenditures and stuff and it is private. We know its illegal, but we have done the whole 9 yards before. Even the lawsuit just eventually got settled with the removal of the President, but Mr. Property Manager is still there. No one dares try to cross him again. He and the last president just used up a ton of HOA funds on their own legal defense on the last lawsuit.

ArielP;

If someone (ANYONE) is harrassing children and or verbally abusing them:

CALL LOCAL LAW ENFORCEMENT as that is a CRIME.

CALL EVERY TIME ~ document the abuse/harrassment.

Case closed.

ps. CAVEAT EMPTOR

Why do you assume it is going to be the Property Manager him or herself? Are they water leak experts? It sounds like they will hire a company and have them come in to do the inspections. That is what most companies or HOA's would do. So don't know why you and your neighbors are so upset with letting this "Jerk" in when most likely he's hiring someone else to do the job. Watch your ASSUMPTIONS...You know what they say about ASSUMMING...

Carol

Who is Mary? My comments have been to the OP, Ariel.

Earlier Ariel said:

although we have a board, we are declarant controlled in that the contract reveals that the President has the power to make decisions without board approval.

If under declarant control then I assume when the declarant meets with his appointed BOD it is not a "BOD Meeting": in the sense that notification must be given and the meeting open.

Am I the confused one..........LOL

Sorry, John46, I mistakenly typed "Mary" at the start of my post. Ellie has cleaned up my mess!

DECLARANT

Typically when a planned association development (regardless of type structure) is started, the Declarant (owner, builder, deleloper, etc.) will draw up a set of Covenants which get filed with the deed (deed restrictions). Often Bylaws might also be drawn up as well as Rules and Regulations.

The Covenants will give the Declarant control in any number of ways. Usually in Types of Ballots (A and B), number of ballots per unit the Declarant owns, unsold lots, etc. There are many ways to skin this cat, but the bottom line is the Declarant controls everything...need I repeat...the Declarant controls everything.

There might even be a BOD during this Declarant control phase. The BOD more then likely will be appointed by the Declarant, there might even be an election but understand one thing, the bottom line is the Declarant still controls everything...need I repeat...the Declarant still controls everything. I am a Declarant appointed member of our BOD. The Declarant appointed me and he can "fire" me as he wishes.

The Covenants will also say when the Declarant has to turn control over to the owners. Usually turnover is when X% of units are sold. Sold as in closed on by a buyer. The % can vary and in some cases state laws controls it. The least I have ever seen is at 51% and the highest is at 100%. My HOA is when the 97th out of 113 homes is sold. Keep in mind sold is when closed on by the owner. Ours read when the 97th unit is sold, the Declarant has one year to turn the HOA over to we owners. Usually there will also be a date when turnover must be done by but the date is so far out (like 10 years) that it rarely comes into play.

Let us beat the dead horse one more time. Until turnover to the owners, the Declarant runs the show...need I repeat....the Declarant runs the show. He does the hiring and firing. As an example, he hires/fires the Property Manager.

One bone of contention (people screaming about or not understanding) on this chat is that during his control, the Declarant can change the Covenants. As an example he might could extend out when he has to turn the association over. He can raise dues. He can change house design. He can allow things people thought could not be done like sheds, fences, etc. Remember..the Declarant is in control. Need I repeat it again?

I say it is usually in ones self interest to work with the Declarant so the turnover to the owners happens fast and smoothly. We have a good working relationship with our Declarant and we are working together to make some Covenant changes that will make it easier for the owners to run the association.

In one large ongoing development (presently 7,000 homes) I know of, the owners will probably never get control. The place has been going on for 20 years and is still growing. In this case 95% of the owners are happy and the smart ones enjoy living there and they let the Declarant and Management Company do their thing.

Hope this helps.

John:

A little clarification to your posts about Declarants.

The Declarant records the declaration of covenants before he begins selling his lots. He cannot impose covenants on lots that he has already sold without the consent of the buyers.

If the declaration calls for an incorporated HOA, he will also file Articles of Incorporation with the state. The declarant normally files the Articles of Incorporation shortly after recording the declaration, but may delay it for some time.

The bylaws are required by state corporation laws and are the rules for how the incorporated association will operate.

State corporation laws also require a Board of Directors to run the incorporated association. The Declarant controls the association by having the votes to put whoever he chooses on the board. State corporate laws require elections but most declarant-controlled boards do not bother as the outcome is pretty well fixed.

Technically, once the declarant has sold any lots, he cannot amend the declaration except under the terms in the declaration.

Whether the declarant can allow exceptions depends on whether the covenants prohibit something, such as sheds. In the example of a non-conforming shed, the declarant-controlled board of directors may grant some sort of waiver or just look the other way. The problem is that if the shed violates the covenants then the board of directors has no authority to allow it. Some other owner may enforce the covenants or, more typically, when the owners take over the board there will be a fight over the shed. The only thing in the shed-owner’s favor is that the statute of limitations may have run out, preventing the owner-controlled association from acting.

Tim

You are correct. Thanks for the clarification.

While not explaining nor even understanding all the ways to do such, need I repeat...the Declarant has control and that is what many need to learn.