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JohnN3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 6
Posted:
O.K. As a member of our BoD I want to get a different perspective on something happening in our community.
Last year our POA of 7 phases (subdivisions)had a Special Meeting to increase annual assesments for three years to purchase a Golf Course that is at our front gate (literally). The vote passed all phases including one which for some reason has a 2/3 requirement instead of majority. The negotiations complete, we had planned to create an LLC out of the Golf Course, and lease it out for 10yrs providing the POA a guaranteed income, providing modest golf discounts to POA members. A week before closing, a lawsuit was filed by 10-12 residents challenging the purchase and the PAO/BoD authority to purchase such.
Now as a member of the BoD IMO we went through Due Diligence by hiring CPA's, Lawyers and Proffesional Appraisers to make sure everything was above board. The hearing is scheduled for the 19th of March, but I'm wondering if any other communities have travelled the same path and what experiences they had when buying a for profit business.
And yes, this issue did create a few rifts in our community. But in our county we are still surging in growth and were concerned over potential developement at our gates which could drop our home values, as well as keeping our community at its current standard.
LanceT (Alabama)
Posts: 121
Posted:
How many residents do you have? I understood you had a 2/3rd's vote but out of how many? I am asking because if the 10 -12 members are in the minority then you have a better chance of winning/settling. Say, you have 100 members, and 75% voted "yes" that means 25 voted "no". Of those 25, only 10 are suing, then you may not have a serious concern if you did everything correct and by the rules. Those 10 are just in minority and lost the vote.
My HOA is a non-profit corporation so I am not that familiar with a "for profit". However, we were setup where we could acquire property if we so desired. We just never had the money nor the property available to do so.
I would question your planned future setup on how profitable this business is going to be. Is it going to be open to the public? If you kept it a "private" course just for the homeowner's in the community you may be under a different set of rules. However, I assume your going to do BOTH and have it private and public accessible.
I am not sure how you will be able to fairly give a discount to the owners and keep reasonable public fees. Remember your owner's are paying for this golf course through their dues, then they must pay out additional money to pay to play. The money they pay to play will be considered "Profit" to the HOA and be subject to taxes. So what do you charge the people from the public? The people from the public aren't paying any dues money. They will be paying a "straight fee". So it could be that the "Public" players are the ones with the real discount and NOT the owners.
That's going to be a difficult rate to figure out. You may start with figuring out how much (%) of the dues money is going toward the golf course per each owner. You would then need to add that amount onto the "Public" players fees plus maybe an additional amount for profit. So a owner may pay $25 to play while someone from the public may pay $100. I don't play golf so I don't know what "reasonable" fees are when playing. However, whatever it is, it needs to draw in customers.

Recovering Ex-President of a HOA
JohnN4 (North Carolina)
Posts: 4
Posted:
Lance, We have about 1200 residents currently, 940 voted and approximately 600 voted to approve the purchase while 300 opposed it. We ran our due diligence to ensure that purchasing the course would be legal, as well as financial and appraisal assesments. The main focal of purchasing it was to protect the acreage in front of our developement, not golfing. We only have about 10-15% of our community who golfs. The committee we designated to work the proposal was both golfers and non-golfers.
With the Lease, eventually the course would pay for itself. It is one of the most coveted courses in the area. The BoD's goal was to protect our community, and the price of the homes as well as maintain our low assesment level. The lease would do both.
HaroldS (Arizona)
Posts: 906
Posted:
John - I guess I don't follow your math. You say one phase required 2/3 to approve, and usually that means 2/3 of the owners, not the voters, and the rest of the phases only required a simple majority. Do you mean a simple majority of those voting or a simple majority of the OWNERS is required to pass such a major purchase? I would assume if one phase requires 2/3 of the owners approval, the other phases would require 50% plus 1 of the OWNERS, not the voters. It looks mighty close to me when you consider the 260 or 22% who did not vote, and the 300 or 25% who voted no. Doesn't look like a mandate to me. Just rambling. Harold
LanceT (Alabama)
Posts: 121
Posted:
Thanks for pointing out the math issue. It appears your HOA needed 900 "Yes" votes altogether to approve the matter. Although you did get 940 to vote, that doesn't mean you got a "Majority" vote. What you got was a majority vote of those who submitted votes. You may need to find out if a "non-vote" counts as a positive vote or a vote at all. That will need legal consultation beyond the means of this forum.
Who is exactly "leasing" the property and to whom? That lease agreement should now turn over to the entire HOA. Is your HOA prepared to handle such lease agreements cohesively?
I am not saying the deal is a bad one. I would like to hear the argument of the other side. Maybe that would lend some light on the matter. I wonder if it is a matter of the correct voting practice or if the upset owners are concerned about the actual investment. If that can be sorted out, then the right recourse can be followed. A voting matter may take a little more effort to rectify. An investment strategy may take more education and detail.

Recovering Ex-President of a HOA
JohnN4 (North Carolina)
Posts: 4
Posted:
The actual wording in the declaration for the phase that requries 2/3s is; "The annual assessment may not be increased without the assent of at least two-thirds of the members of the Association at a meeting called for that purpose, with at least 60% of the Lot Owners or their proxies present after 30 days' notice. If 60% are not present, a second meeting may be called with 30 days' notice and the quorum may be reduced to 30% of the Lot Owners or their proxies."

That was interpreted to be 2/3 at the meeting, not all owners. The other areas simply a majority, with 10% creating a quorum. Incidentally, I live in that phase, and we (BoD) are trying to streamline all the decalarations as they come expire to mirror this one which is the most stringent, and provides owners more say in the community. As for the votes, that wasn't even identified in the suit, the crust was the POA's authority to purchase it. Which according to the lawyers we hired is covered under the declaration, as well as the NC Statutes for Non-profits and HOA's (NC55&47). The lease was going to be to one of the current owners son's who is a golf pro and manages another local course. The leasee would pay everything (taxes, maintenance, etc) except major capitol improvements. It looked like positive cash flow for the POA for 10yrs. I might add, that the out of the 10 suing 4 are realtors who own numerous lots in our community, and have an office at our entrance. If they develop that area it would surely put money in their pockets. But thats mere speculation, which is of course why we looked at purchasing it in the first place, as a Florida developement company had signed 1st look papers to purchase it initially. The lawsuit can be viewed here, under Golf Course purchase. I think we maintain a pretty good sight for the community, all by volunteers what do you think?

http://www.carolinalakes.com/
HaroldS (Arizona)
Posts: 906
Posted:
You may need to find out if a "non-vote" counts as a positive vote or a vote at all.>>>> A non vote is always a no vote. If all non votes of elegible voters were allowed to be counted as a yes vote in say a city or school bond election, I'm sure the city/school would be delighted. If non votes were counted as a yes vote, why would anyone bother to vote if they favored an issue? I think we had a discussion about this recently. Harold

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