Resident keeps falling

Started by BonnieG1 • 18 replies • 1922 views

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BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186

Posted:

There is one owner who falls multiple times. I have helped her up in the past by taking a solild piece of furniture to her so that she can lift herself up.
I hear she fell in the garage (a 43 unit condo in NE with a 31 stall parking garage) today and a man actually helped her up. Then she got in her car and drove away.

Nebraska has a good samaritan law that protects someone from damages if a person who they are trying to help gets hurt.

We have been advised by the nurses who work in the care center that is adjacent to our building that we should call 911 when she falls. I hear that shee absolutely told the people who were by her NOT to call 911. Her family has been notified of this fall and previous falls she has had.

I personally don't like to be around her when she is walking in the hall because I am afraid she will fall.

Does anyone on this site have any other suggestions as to what we can do?

JM10 (California)
Posts: 503

Posted:

How sad.

What is the age and reason this person falls?

I ask because in the case it is an elderly person living alone, this will only get worse. I see you note that her family has already been contacted. You might request that her family meet with the concerned residents and see if there is some kind of professional care that can be provided.

An ambulance might be a bit much, particularly since she is not really an emergency.

If the person is falling because of a regular disability or an intermittent disability (like multiple sclerosis), medical care may also be available.

I don't see that this is, however, a concern for the HOA except possibly in terms of liability (if she falls and injures herself in the common area) and the possibility that the reason for her falling may also make driving a problem and lead to an accident in the HOA garage.

BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186

Posted:

It is my understanding that her brain is not giving the correct message to her feet. Also she has been told she needs knee surgery and refuses to get the surgery. I think she would refuse any help, but am not certain. We have considered calling the Adult Protectivie Services.

For a while she wasn't driving. We think her daughter took the keys away, but now she is driving.

ALso she only has one daughter who needs throat surgery, recently lost her job and has had cancer recently.

LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By BonnieG1 on 10/08/2012 6:54 AM
It is my understanding that her brain is not giving the correct message to her feet. Also she has been told she needs knee surgery and refuses to get the surgery. I think she would refuse any help, but am not certain. We have considered calling the Adult Protectivie Services.

For a while she wasn't driving. We think her daughter took the keys away, but now she is driving.

ALso she only has one daughter who needs throat surgery, recently lost her job and has had cancer recently.

Bonnie,

My understanding is that one of the problems that accompanies senile dementia is frequent falling. Given the frequent falling, the refusal to get needed surgery, and the driving issues, I think a call to APS is not out of line.

PaulT6 (California)
Posts: 409

Posted:

Bonnie,

My wife and I have gone through this with both of our mothers and my wife's aunt. Bad news is that it is going to get worse. As long as the HOA facilities are up to structural and occupational codes I don't think there is much of a HOA liability issue.

The driving thing is a concern, she could easily take out some innocent person. I would notify the APS, stand back and let the chips fall where they may.

Paul T

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

I have had this issue in and out of a HOA. I would strongly recommend that "Help I have fallen and can't get up" call system advertised. It is well worth it even though the advertising is annnoying. See if someone can talk to the daughter about this and get a brochure. It may not cost that much. She will still need a "call" person nearby to come check on her. She may even need a motorized chair. Another consideration to get a brochure about to the family.

I would also consult the people next door who deal with this on a daily basis. They may be able to help with consultatation with the family. It is time to consult the experts. Hopefully, she won't fall so badly by then to break something. My neighbor broke her hip a few times falling. Put her in the hospital. That helped the family get the information and help they needed.

Former HOA President

JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,569

Posted:

It is my understanding that her brain is not giving the correct message to her feet.

yet you have not notified the dept of motor vehicles

driving upon the public highways is merely a PRIVILEDGE, not a 'right'

should anyone be injured or killed as a result of her continued driving, imo, any person who could possibly have stopped her IS EQUALLY RESPONSIBLE

....the king of tough love

EdmundS1 (North Carolina)
Posts: 45

Posted:

I agree that the HOA, if the common areas are in good shape, has little, if any liability.

I would stop with the "family contact", commumity outreach groups, etc. and follow the advice of the nurses next door. Call 911, if you see her fall call 911 and then go help her. Then if she says "don't call" you have to tell her that they already have been called.

She needs a full medical evaluation and she may not be capable of living on her own any longer. Doctors can state that a person is not capable of living unsupervised and refuse to release the patient.

At that point the family will have to get more involved (hope she has more then just the daughter with her own problems) and consider assisted living, etc.

Helping her get up, get in her car and watch her drive away is putting other people in danger....

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Bonnie

While I appreciate your concern for the person, a bit of tough love here.

It is not an HOA issue.

From a personal point of view, help as you can.

From an HOA point of view, stay out of it.

If you want to call someone then say it is Bonnie So and So calling. Not the So and So Association calling.

If memory serves me correctly, your association/building is associated with an elder care/nursing home facility. Am I correct?

If so, they may well have the resources need to help the person. Talk to them, but agian, only as a person, not the association.

Hope this helps.

JonD1
Posts: 2,350

Posted:

Bonnie:

This woman should NOT be driving under ANY circumstances.

On a local property last year an older woman who no longer should have been driving drove her car in reverse striking a woman who was walking with her husband along the roadway. The woman fell under the car and was dragged along the roadway for some distance as the woman driving could not hear the screams to stop due to hearing loss.

The story I got from the MC who handles the property the victim made it to the hospital but she suffered severe injuries including having most of her skin torn off her body. After a short time of suffering in a living hell she died.

The woman was found to be incapble of driving and her license was revoked but still the victim is gone because no one bothered to address this. I would not want to live with something like this knowing I turned a blind eye when she drove by!

The police and or DMV should be notified ASAP if not by the HOA then by someone who is willing to do what needs to be done.

BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JohnC46 on 10/08/2012 2:42 PM
Bonnie

While I appreciate your concern for the person, a bit of tough love here.

It is not an HOA issue.

From a personal point of view, help as you can.

From an HOA point of view, stay out of it.

If you want to call someone then say it is Bonnie So and So calling. Not the So and So Association calling.

If memory serves me correctly, your association/building is associated with an elder care/nursing home facility. Am I correct?

If so, they may well have the resources need to help the person. Talk to them, but agian, only as a person, not the association.

Hope this helps.

the nurses at the care center advised us to call 911 for this lady. They will not come over. They would come over if it were someone who dosn't frequently fall.
We did discuss this issue at our meeting tonight and basically decided to call 911 and let the lady who falls sign off that she refused treatment.
Most of us who live here have our own issues with back, knees, etc.

JM10 (California)
Posts: 503

Posted:

Time for tough love.

If kindness to one person means cruelty to another, then you do have to be cruel to be kind.

She shouldn't be driving. Her daughter knows this. She's been told this by her daughter. She could kill someone. Someone needs to report on this. If her daughter won't do this, perhaps someone can do it anonymously.

Call 911 when she falls.

Here's another question: If you know someone shouldn't be driving, but allow her to drive then what is the legal/ethical/moral liability?

Her daughter should be notified and might want to file papers to guardianship if possible, but that is not the HOA's concern.

My father had to stop driving. He had MS. Thank goodness he had the good sense although there was that one time with us kids in the car (MS can come and go, but then come back for the long haul).

JM10 (California)
Posts: 503

Posted:

KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239

Posted:

If an old lady falls down, you should pick her up and get her own her way safely.

The HOA needs to stay out of her family business and resist using its power to diagnose dementia, fitness to drive, etc. That's kinda funny and my imagination runs wild with the concept of "assessing" my own neighbors through HOA board action.

KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239

Posted:

SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699

Posted:

Quote:

The HOA needs to stay out of her family business and resist using its power to diagnose dementia, fitness to drive, etc.

I agree. The HOA cannot diagnose this woman. If an old lady falls, I'm calling 911 and leaving it up to the professionals to diagnose her. She may really need help, but no one has addressed it yet.

BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KellyM3 on 10/09/2012 7:00 PM

If an old lady falls down, you should pick her up and get her own her way safely.

The HOA needs to stay out of her family business and resist using its power to diagnose dementia, fitness to drive, etc. That's kinda funny and my imagination runs wild with the concept of "assessing" my own neighbors through HOA board action.

I agree with you about not diagnosing dementia. However it was a doctor that said her brain was not giving the correct message to her leg. I repectfully disagree with you about picking her up. This is a senior facility and almost everyone who lives here (many in their 80s, 90s and even one over 100) have their own health issues and back problems including me. We physically cannot pick her up. What we have done is taken something solid for her to help herself up, but this is even difficult.

My knees are giving me many problems although I haven't fallen because of my knees, but it is difficult for me to get up from a sitting position. I have fibromyalgea and osteo arthritis all through my body and you are suggesting the I pick this lady up?????????????????????????

KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239

Posted:

I missed the point that this community is a form of independent living community for seniors. Okay, I concede that special consideration needs to be given for that fact, especially if neighbors aren't physically able to lift a fallen person. You can always call your county social services to check in on this person but that should be a private call and not through the HOA's domain.

JM10 (California)
Posts: 503

Posted:

If someone has fallen and can't get themselves up, that's a lot of weight for the average person to have to deal with. It doesn't matter what age you are, you could easily hurt your own back, particularly if that person is 2/3 of your weight, your weight or, worst case scenario heavier than you (which in my case is the majority of adults). In addition, you don't know if moving them will increase the injury/pain/problem.

If the daughter has already taken away the keys and attempted to stop the woman from driving...that's a sign of a greater problem.

Call 911 and allow professional to deal with it. If she has a condition that would prevent her from driving safely, then the emergency room/ambulance call reports will become part of the documentation. Further, she'll had to reconsider the exact limitations of her stubborn independence.

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