Can a HOA force you to get mold inspection before they approve you to sell IN FLORIDA with no proof of previous water damage.

Started by JeffJ6 • 15 replies • 2612 views

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JeffJ6 (Florida)
Posts: 6

Posted:

My HOA says the previous owner had a leaky ac that leaked below my unit and now they want me to pay for a mold inspection to be done for the bottom unit before i can sell it. They want the workers to cut into the wall and check the inside of the wall. They have not giving me any paperwork by a professional to state to me that there is mold. Who am i to take their word for it. Can they make me pay for it without the proper paperwork. This has been a nightmare dealing with hoas.

They have been holding me hostage from selling my place for 3 months. The property is owned out right. I need official document from a contractor to say that i must have a inspection. Today the sent me an email from a person that runs a mold inspection company saying it might be mold but they have not done a inspection before the hung the new dry wall so the do not know. They are saying they will charge 600 do drill in the wall and test. It seems to be a personal associate o the HOA president.

HELP ME PLEASE WHAT TO DO?
P.S THIS IS IN SOUTH FLORIDA

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062

Posted:

Jeff,

What do your Associations governing documents say concerning the involvement/authority the Association has over sales?

JeffJ6 (Florida)
Posts: 6

Posted:

ON Section

B.Destruction of Improvements it states that If any part of the condominium property is damaged or destroyed by casualty whether or not it shall be reconstructed or repaired. shall be determined in the following manner.

5. RESPONSIBILITY - If the damage is only to parts of (1)unit for which the responsibility and maintenance and repair is that of the unit owner, then the unit owner shall be responsible for reconstruction and repair after the casualty. In all other instances the responsibly reconstruction or repair after the casualty is that of the Association.

JeffJ6 (Florida)
Posts: 6

Posted:

it doesnt mention nothing about their involvement in the sale of the condo.

FredS7 (Arizona)
Posts: 927

Posted:

> They have been holding me hostage from selling my place for 3 months.

Exactly how have they been doing this?

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062

Posted:

Ok, let me see if I understand this.

1) Previous owner of your unit had a leak that caused mold in the lower unit.

2) It's expected (but not known) that the previous issue was resolved with the previous owner. Is this a known fact?

3) You have lived there for x years.

4) Now that your selling, the owner of the lower unit wants you to pay for a mold inspection because of some unknown problem (what are they complaining about exactly?).

5) The HOA is involved (perhaps by declaring this issue on a disclosure) that is keeping you from selling your unit.

Is this correct?

JeffJ6 (Florida)
Posts: 6

Posted:

by coming up with new things for me to do before i can sell..I have already lost 2 buyers over this. Now they want me to pay 600 dollars to have a mold inspection done to my downstairs neighbors walls. It doesn't make sense. I wasnt the one living there when the leak happened. Also, the condo docs states im only responsible for my unit as Ive posted above but they keeep insisting im responsible. I just want some advice please.

LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JeffJ6 on 10/03/2012 9:06 AM
ON Section

B.Destruction of Improvements it states that If any part of the condominium property is damaged or destroyed by casualty whether or not it shall be reconstructed or repaired. shall be determined in the following manner.

5. RESPONSIBILITY - If the damage is only to parts of (1)unit for which the responsibility and maintenance and repair is that of the unit owner, then the unit owner shall be responsible for reconstruction and repair after the casualty. In all other instances the responsibly reconstruction or repair after the casualty is that of the Association.

Jeff,

The way I read that passage is that if the damage was inside your unit you would be responsible for repair. If it is not inside your unit (that is, the unit below you) then you are not responsible for the repair. In most condos, the owner is only responsible for the interior space and everything outside of that is common area.

Your original post indicates that the association wants to look inside the walls (an area that you are not responsible for).

Are you certain that this is the only provision in the declaration regarding damage? Would a leaking a/c unit be considered a casualty? I have heard that a sudden flow of water, such as a burst pipe, is covered by casualty insurance but a dripping pipe is not.

If the damage occurred before you purchased the unit, why did the association not test for damage before they allowed the unit to be sold? It sounds like they dropped the ball and want you to pay for their neglect.

JeffJ6 (Florida)
Posts: 6

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By TimB4 on 10/03/2012 9:22 AM
Ok, let me see if I understand this.

1) Previous owner of your unit had a leak that caused mold in the lower unit. correct

2) It's expected (but not known) that the previous issue was resolved with the previous owner. Is this a known fact? the previous owner did not resolved the issue with the hoa, which includes replacing the wall ac units. I acquired the property and replaced them correctly.

3) You have lived there for x years. I bought the property to re-sell, I don't live there. acquired the property in May.

4) Now that your selling, the owner of the lower unit wants you to pay for a mold inspection because of some unknown problem (what are they complaining about exactly?). The HOA is blocking the sale because water leaked a year ago, they replaced the drywall year ago, but did not do a mold test, now they want me to do a mold test from a leak that happened almost 2 years ago with them NOT showing me proof that the leak happened. the owner below me is not complaining its just the HOA.

5) The HOA is involved (perhaps by declaring this issue on a disclosure) that is keeping you from selling your unit. They have declared there is mold in the estoppel sent to the title agency without official paperwork to me or the title agency. only going by what the guys who replaced the drywall said a year ago.

Is this correct?

JeffJ6 (Florida)
Posts: 6

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JeffJ6 on 10/03/2012 9:33 AM

Posted By TimB4 on 10/03/2012 9:22 AM
Ok, let me see if I understand this.

1) Previous owner of your unit had a leak that caused mold in the lower unit.

correct

2) It's expected (but not known) that the previous issue was resolved with the previous owner. Is this a known fact?

the previous owner did not resolved the issue with the hoa, which includes replacing the wall ac units. I acquired the property and replaced them correctly.

3) You have lived there for x years.

I bought the property to re-sell, I don't live there. acquired the property in May.

4) Now that your selling, the owner of the lower unit wants you to pay for a mold inspection because of some unknown problem (what are they complaining about exactly?).

The HOA is blocking the sale because water leaked a year ago, they replaced the drywall year ago, but did not do a mold test, now they want me to do a mold test from a leak that happened almost 2 years ago with them NOT showing me proof that the leak happened. the owner below me is not complaining its just the HOA.

5) The HOA is involved (perhaps by declaring this issue on a disclosure) that is keeping you from selling your unit.

They have declared there is mold in the estoppel sent to the title agency without official paperwork to me or the title agency no I may lose another buyer. only going by what the guys who replaced the drywall said a year ago.

Is this correct?

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

I would like to know how they are stopping the sale because they have NO contractual business in sales of property. Only adherence to their rules. If the downstairs unit has an issue believed caused by the upstairs, then they already know the cause. It is time they just deal with the downstairs person and just make sure it won't happen again. Maybe requesting to make sure to have the AC unit fixed at the minimum.

I hate mold people. Mold is NOT toxic and can be remedied by simple water and bleach sprayed on the walls. Plus the fact the mold may be INSIDE the walls means it is NOT exposed mold. It would be different if it was exposed. Carpet has mold on it and so does the back of shower units in bathrooms. If there were ever a test then there would always be a positive result. That result does NOT mean dangerous or toxic mold. Just the presence of mold. You give in to the test then they want the repairs.

Hate to say it, but may be time for a lawyer. Atleast give the HOA notice that you are NOT responsible for their mold testing or results of that testing IF the test is done. They think they know the cause doesn't mean they can force the cure. Just make sure you are up to date on your dues and tell them to leave you alone or you can take them to court for interefering with your contract. If they sue you then just tell them to bring it on and countersue for your expenses. Much cheaper for you to countersue anyways...The only way they can stop you from selling is putting a lien on your place. Otherwise you don't need your buyers contacting or being contacted by the HOA. The buyer's are the only one's responsible for being informed. You can give them a copy of your CC&R's and other documents. Let them know where to send the dues. However, the HOA shouldn't contact them directly. It's the buyer who should do that.

Former HOA President

JeanneK3 (Maryland)
Posts: 562

Posted:

Jeff:
Are they refusing to give your potential buyer a "resale package?" If so then this is blackmail plain and simple and you should file a complaint with the state immediately. They are using your need to sell as an excuse to force you to pay for something the association should be paying for. Cute.
Jeanne

KevinK7 (Florida)
Posts: 1,343

Posted:

So the HOA is demanding a mold check because they claim the previous owner had a leak and the previous owner caused mold?

Why didn't they stop the previous owner from selling?

PeterD3 (Florida)
Posts: 708

Posted:

Jeff,

Stop wasting your time looking for some loophole here.

Get legal help.

Condos CAN prevent sales in Fla. as described in their documents.
Your assn. may have never been challenged before and could be abusing their authority or may have absolute jurisdiction.

Maybe the previous seller had to do the same? Do you know they did'nt? I did not see mention of that.

Some molds may not be toxic per se but other types can PRODUCE toxins which some people are allergic to.
For example, most of us enjoy peanuts or their derivatives, but to some they can be fatal.

This is not to bolster their arguement for testing but facts which can be verified by the CDC an other sources.

Melissa proposes a simplistic solution which is rarely achievable due to accessability and will reduce the structural integrity of drywall if that is the type of construction you have.

JanV (Florida)
Posts: 1

Posted:

Jeff'

I've been going thru the mold thing. I bought a home that the woman swore there was no mold, after in the house 2 months all you could smell was mold. I tore out 3 bathroom walls and replaced them plus half the floor from mold. I was starting to feel ill. Mold can kill you and I'm allergic to it and had told her so. After a ride out by ambulance and 10 days in the hospital on drip antbiotics stronger than penicillon, loosing 30# and unable to walk un-assisted and on oxygen I returned home, sspent less than 24 hours and was carried out again. Am still on oxygen. MOLD KILLS !!! The spores can get in the lungs and continue to grow in the nice, moist, warmth.

So I called for a mold inspection. $650.00 He came with all the infra red, testers, sniffers. Looked thru the walls, doors, floors, window sills and there was more MOLD. This saved me from ripping out every wall in the house. By now the smell was horrible. He also took samples of air thru out the house, dust off furniture. Luckely my furniture can be cleaned. My floors, drapes and carpet cleaned. All the walls washed down. Central a/c ducts cleaned. And I only had to rip out 1 door, 4' of wall on each side and the entry floor and 2 bedroom walls. Just the door area was another $850. I went to the seller of the houses snd she said she'd pay that and $150 towards the bathroom, but now that its done she's refusing, saying the house was an "as is sale".

I called attourneys and no one will take it. Saying you don't usually win and if so not much. There is a Fl. law that says its illegal to knowingly sell property with mold and I have her e-mails saying she'll pay and also asking me what she can do so I will enjoy my home. I haven't even mentioned my hospital bills. And I'm still not able to live in the home until its all cleaned. This started the middle of July.

Bleach or vinigar does not get rid of mold. You have to replace the wood, mold has like little feelers that go dodwn into the wood and any dampness will keep it growing. There is a professional spray you can get that you soak the wood with but first the dampness has to be stopped.

My only other choice is to try small claims court on personal injury but the mold inspecter won't go with you and I understand that even for small claims now you have to have an attrny.

If you find out anything to help let me know. I'm 72 and would really like to enjoy my home a little.

JM10 (California)
Posts: 503

Posted:

Look over your CC&R and talk with your real estate agent. Your agent would know what is the usual procedure and might be able to help you with your CC&R as well. Your agent isn't a lawyer, but would know about common practices.

From your agent's advice, you might then go to a lawyer.

We also had problems welling our condo because of the HOA. They wouldn't give answers, respond to us or our real estate agent.

They wouldn't even tell us where we could post signs (we needed permission, but they refused to put it on an agenda since in California they can even dictate the color), wouldn't respond to FHA certification inquiries and even stole the real estate agent's sign. The police had to retrieve it.

Our problem was termites. We had asked that that whole building be inspected (and the company would give a discount to all units that wanted their property inspected along with the common areas), but the HOA board refused and only paid for inspection of one unit (a board member's unit). Over a year later, termites were found because a termite inspection is required prior to sale. The real estate agent asked about it to the board. We asked as well. They refused to have a meeting (or tell us about a meeting). We took care of our part but since termites were found in the ceiling rafters, most likely there are termites in the other units and really what should have happened is all the units should have been tented and fumigated.

We understand your pain. But we asked our agents what was the common practice and the agents then became our witnesses. Get it all in writing and begin documenting the harassment. The insurance had to payout for that and other harassment/discrimination and that included our attorney fees.

Good luck.

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