Hearing - No Response

Started by JavierD • 25 replies • 1688 views

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JavierD (Florida)
Posts: 34

Posted:

After I received a notice from the HOA that I need to remove an structure I built in my rear patio, I requested a hearing with the board of director. In the hearing they will have the intention to find a solution , but the HOA manager said that they have to discuss with the attorney and in 2 weeks will send me the decision.

The convenants also said that the association and board of directors , has to send me a written decision no more late than 21 days after the hearing .

Now is around 30 days , and I dont received any respond. Do they are in violation to failed to send me a written decision? Looks that they are ignoring the initial issue.

Your thoughts is very appreciate.

SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699

Posted:

Talk to the HOA manager. Ask him.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

I doubt that they are ignoring the initial issue of you building a structure on your rear patio.

Is the issue that you failed to get prior permission to build the structure or that the structure is prohibited based on the covenants?

It's more likely that the Board is either waiting for a response from the attorney or waiting for the next board meeting to decide how to respond to your request.

JavierD (Florida)
Posts: 34

Posted:

Yes, I built an structure after get a verbal approval , but then the manager from the HOA said that never said that. My question is that the convenant prohibit a shed or storage room, but during the meeting the board of director show the intention to help me with the issue. The manager who gave me the verbal approval is the person giving now hard time.

The convenant are clear in regards the period of time they have to respond (21 days ). There are not owners involved in this community since the HOA still under control of developer (new project).

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Can you provide the language in your documents that discusses the 21 days?

Board of Directors are not authorized to waive a covenant. Only an amendment to the covenants or a higher precedent law (State or Federal) can change or waive that section of the covenants.

JavierD (Florida)
Posts: 34

Posted:

B. Hearing

The alleged non-compliance shall be presented to the hearing committee after which the hearing committee shall hear a reason why a fine(s) or suspension should be impossed. The owner shall have the right to be represented by counsel and to cross examine witnesses. If the hearing commitee by majority vote, does not approve a proposed fine(s) or suspension, it may not be imposed. A written decision of the hearing committee shall be submitted to the owner not later than 21 days after the hearing.

JavierD (Florida)
Posts: 34

Posted:

They considered my structure as tool/storage room the documents said in regards of this kind of structure the below condition .

Building Type:

No building shall be erected altered, placed, or permitted to remain on any lot other than one detached single family residence , not to exceed 35 feet in height , including a private closed garage for not less than two no more than fours cars. Unless approved by the committee as to use, location and architectural design, no garage, tool or storage room my be constructed separate and apart from the residence, nor can any of the aforementioned structures be constructed prior to the main residence.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Based on what you provided, it appears that you were not allowed to construct your structure.

What is the language about the 21 days?

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Javier

Are you not the fellow that had been posting about the tool shed you built without HOA written permission?

JavierD (Florida)
Posts: 34

Posted:

Yes John , In the hearing the try to working with a waiver. Then the manager said to the board of director that if they allow me to keep the storage room or shed , they cannot deny this in the future to others home owners.

The board of director gave me the hint to plant some trees behind the shed to hidden the roof, but after that and due to manager concern they told me that the written decision will be send in two weeks after the hearing. This never happened and now is almost 30 days without repond.

The convenant said that they have 21 days to send me the written decision after the hearing.

JavierD (Florida)
Posts: 34

Posted:

Tim

I already posted the language in regards to the 21 days .

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Nice Catch John.

Per that original posting, dated August 18, Javier had 30 days to remove the structure. 30 days should be around now.

Per another thread, that seems to have been posted after the Board held a hearing, a waiver was being discussed and the Board was going to seek an opinion from their attorney. Based on that thread, everyone recommended that Javier gets any such waiver in writing.

Javier,

Were does this 21 day time limit you are posting about come from?
Would you cite the language of it?

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JavierD on 09/18/2012 9:41 AM
B. Hearing

The alleged non-compliance shall be presented to the hearing committee after which the hearing committee shall hear a reason why a fine(s) or suspension should be impossed. The owner shall have the right to be represented by counsel and to cross examine witnesses. If the hearing commitee by majority vote, does not approve a proposed fine(s) or suspension, it may not be imposed. A written decision of the hearing committee shall be submitted to the owner not later than 21 days after the hearing.

Sorry Javier,

I missed it.

Based on the other information available in other posts, I would simply recommend that you follow-up with the Board and ask the status of the waiver as you were of the impression that you would have received it by now.

JavierD (Florida)
Posts: 34

Posted:

The 21 days time limit I posted is part of my HOA convenants.

JavierD (Florida)
Posts: 34

Posted:

Tim

Do they are now in violation to failed follow the convenants in regard to the 21 days period to responnd ?

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Javier

Allow me to refresh and correct me if I am wrong.

1. You built this shed which is clearly in violation but you claim "someone" verbally told you it would be OK.

2. You were ordered to remove the shed.

3. You appealed the removal order to the BOD and they verbally said they would work with you and discuss a waiver.

21 days or not, regardless of what the property manager has said, the question is have you officially (in writing) heard from the BOD since your meeting with them?

JavierD (Florida)
Posts: 34

Posted:

John

I don't heard anything back from the Board of Director or HOA and 21 days based on the convenant already expired.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JavierD on 09/18/2012 10:24 AM
Tim

Do they are now in violation to failed follow the convenants in regard to the 21 days period to responnd ?

Based on your all of your postings, I do not think the Board is on a time limit.

That time limit is for a hearing before a fining committee (to discuss if you should have a fine or not associated with a violation). You had a hearing before the board who, based on your posting, said that they would try to work with you.

However, if you believe that they are on a 21 day time limit, there is nothing within that passage that specifies if the time limit was missed that the alleged violation is dismissed.

Since, per your postings, it appears that you are indeed in violation of the Covenants, I wouldn't necessarily push any time limit and I refer you to my original suggestion of politely contacting the board to see if they have reached a decision.

JavierD (Florida)
Posts: 34

Posted:

Tim

Thanks for your advise . What you said is that if they decided to send me a decision in 4 months , they are right because they dont have a period of time?

When I requested a hearing they have 14 days to coordinate a hearing, and they did in the period of time, however a written decision must have to send the homeowner no more than 21 days after the hearing they failed with this condition.

I also agree that the condition dont said anything in regards to dismissal if they are not comply with the convenant condition.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Javier

Do not assume, expect, try, think, etc. that just because you have not heard back from then within 21 days that you have approval. You do not.

Tim suggested a polite phone call maybe to one of the BOD members that seemed receptive to your appeal. I agree. Be friendly, polite, not demanding nor threatening.

I am sorry but I believe they are well within their rights to demand this shed be removed so walk lightly until you officially hear something.

Hope this helps.

JavierD (Florida)
Posts: 34

Posted:

Thanks John. No news is a good news for me.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Actually, no news is uncertainty.

You might want to get a copy of the minutes of the meeting you had with them.
Perhaps those minutes might shed some more light on the issue.

JavierD (Florida)
Posts: 34

Posted:

My friend that is an attorney has those notes. Thanks

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JavierD on 09/18/2012 12:06 PM
My friend that is an attorney has those notes. Thanks

Jav

Notes and the "official minutes" are two different things. Be sure you have a copy of the minutes.

BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JavierD on 09/18/2012 12:06 PM
My friend that is an attorney has those notes. Thanks

From personal experience, it is unwise to rely on the free advice of an attorney who gives that advice simply because he happens to be a friend.

GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491

Posted:

Javier you my friend are a piece of work, you read the CC&R's enough to know you needed written approval for your fence, which according to your first post you sought and got. Then knowing it was against the CC&R's you supposedly verbally asked if it was OK to build your shed. Now according to you the PM said OK but keep it below the fence line so it wasn't visible. Did you listen? No you built the roof above the fence line and got caught.

I remember your posts and how we (the forum) told you to go to the Board and admit your wrong and ask for forgiveness. Now you want to complain and look for a loophole because they didn't get back to you fast enough. The section you cited required 21 day notice of either a fine or suspension, according to you they wanted you to remove the shed, that is not a fine or a suspension, so that section wouldn't apply.

As others have said, walk softly and politely ask if the Board has reached a decision. I personally wouldn't even ask for a month or so because if you are too much of a pest, they will probably turn you down.

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