NancyG3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 342
Posts: 342
Posted:
Can a homeowner before the meeting is called to order ask to speak to the homeowners and Board? The members received a letter from the President that has raised many questions.
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NancyG3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 342
Posts: 342
Posted:
I forgot to add. This would also help the homeowners voting for 3 opening to the Board of Directors. The BOD received a lot of proxies and this is how they keep being voted back in. The BOD does not let the homeowners know who has submitted an application to run for the board until they get to the meeting. Noone knows when the proxies are mailed out.
BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535
Posts: 2,535
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NancyG3 on 07/26/2012 7:40 AM
Can a homeowner before the meeting is called to order ask to speak to the homeowners and Board? The members received a letter from the President that has raised many questions.
Can a homeowner before the meeting is called to order ask to speak to the homeowners and Board? The members received a letter from the President that has raised many questions.
I suppose you can ask. Whether or not you will be given an opportunity to is another matter.
BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535
Posts: 2,535
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NancyG3 on 07/26/2012 8:03 AM
Noone knows when the proxies are mailed out.
Noone knows when the proxies are mailed out.
How can you not know this? Don't you receive one?
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Nancy
My experience says there is not a black and white answer to your question.
There are often rule and regulations about Annual Meetings where owners must be allowed to speak. The BOD does not have to respond to questions. They can simply say thank you for you input and we will consider it.
Rules and Regulations on other BOD meetings are not so clear.
Myself, I would always invite members to all BOD Meeeting and allow them an opportunity to speak before and/or after the meeting. Not that the BOD has to respond, but they would have to listen.
Executive Sessions are a different subject. They can be limited to BOD Members only.
Owner or not, people are not going to be asked their opinions and/or asked to vote on every issue that comes across the BOD meeting table. The BOD was elected to run the association. Agree with them or not, they are charged to do so.
Hope this helps.
My experience says there is not a black and white answer to your question.
There are often rule and regulations about Annual Meetings where owners must be allowed to speak. The BOD does not have to respond to questions. They can simply say thank you for you input and we will consider it.
Rules and Regulations on other BOD meetings are not so clear.
Myself, I would always invite members to all BOD Meeeting and allow them an opportunity to speak before and/or after the meeting. Not that the BOD has to respond, but they would have to listen.
Executive Sessions are a different subject. They can be limited to BOD Members only.
Owner or not, people are not going to be asked their opinions and/or asked to vote on every issue that comes across the BOD meeting table. The BOD was elected to run the association. Agree with them or not, they are charged to do so.
Hope this helps.
NancyG3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 342
Posts: 342
Posted:
Bruce - What I meant by this is nobody knows who is running for the Board until the day we sign in at the annual meeting and then they hand out the ballot and the people that are running to be a Board member are listed.
When the proxy is mailed out it does not tell the homeowners who is running for the Board. The proxy states: "Please sign, date and return the "Proxy" whether you plan to attend the meeting or if you are unable to attend the meeting. ALL PROXIES SHOULD BE MAILED TO THE SECRETARY (XXXXXXXXXX)AT ASSOCIATION NAME AND ADDRESS. PROXIES RECEIVED WILL BE TURNED OVER TO THE HOMEOWNER NAMED ON THE PROXY AT THE START OF THE MEETING." If you attend the Annual meeting the Proxy will be returned to you at registration.
The proxy only has the present Board members listed and a blank line under the Board names with a ( )to check. It states: "I hereby designate the Board Member whose name is checked below or the member whose name is written as my proxy with power and substitution to vote for me at the 2012 Annual (Assn name)meeting, or any adjournment of such meeting".
The person that wants to be a board member was asked to have their application into the secretary 1 week before the meeting so she can put their name on the ballot. Nothing is mailed out to the homeowners telling them who is running for the Board.
When the proxy is mailed out it does not tell the homeowners who is running for the Board. The proxy states: "Please sign, date and return the "Proxy" whether you plan to attend the meeting or if you are unable to attend the meeting. ALL PROXIES SHOULD BE MAILED TO THE SECRETARY (XXXXXXXXXX)AT ASSOCIATION NAME AND ADDRESS. PROXIES RECEIVED WILL BE TURNED OVER TO THE HOMEOWNER NAMED ON THE PROXY AT THE START OF THE MEETING." If you attend the Annual meeting the Proxy will be returned to you at registration.
The proxy only has the present Board members listed and a blank line under the Board names with a ( )to check. It states: "I hereby designate the Board Member whose name is checked below or the member whose name is written as my proxy with power and substitution to vote for me at the 2012 Annual (Assn name)meeting, or any adjournment of such meeting".
The person that wants to be a board member was asked to have their application into the secretary 1 week before the meeting so she can put their name on the ballot. Nothing is mailed out to the homeowners telling them who is running for the Board.
BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535
Posts: 2,535
Posted:
Nancy,
In most situations I believe it would be impossible to know who is running for the board until the meeting takes place because I believe that many associations' bylaws provide for nominations from the floor.
If one cannot attend the meeting in person, one should assign the proxy to a person that can be trusted, along with specific instructions, such as "if so-and-so runs, vote for that person," or, "under no circumstances are you to vote for these people" followed by a list of names. Since a proxy is your personal representative at the meeting, if floor nominations are allowed, you can instruct your proxy to nominate a specific person.
In most situations I believe it would be impossible to know who is running for the board until the meeting takes place because I believe that many associations' bylaws provide for nominations from the floor.
If one cannot attend the meeting in person, one should assign the proxy to a person that can be trusted, along with specific instructions, such as "if so-and-so runs, vote for that person," or, "under no circumstances are you to vote for these people" followed by a list of names. Since a proxy is your personal representative at the meeting, if floor nominations are allowed, you can instruct your proxy to nominate a specific person.
NancyG3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 342
Posts: 342
Posted:
Thanks Bruce: Our bylaws do provide for nominations from the floor, however, in times past the people that want to run their information was sent out to the homeowners prior to the meeting. The present Board has not ever done this and this is one of the reason we can't get them out of office.
Most of the people believe the proxy is the ballot. No specific instructions have ever been placed on our proxy.
Most of the people believe the proxy is the ballot. No specific instructions have ever been placed on our proxy.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Nancy
As you describe it, it appears to be simply members on the BOD using proper procedures to get themselves re-elected by simply gathering proxies with their names on them. Slight of hand maybe, but probably nothing worse.
I think you have to better aquaint yourself with your associations docs especially about running for the BOD, voting, proxies, quorums, etc.
Hope this helps.
As you describe it, it appears to be simply members on the BOD using proper procedures to get themselves re-elected by simply gathering proxies with their names on them. Slight of hand maybe, but probably nothing worse.
I think you have to better aquaint yourself with your associations docs especially about running for the BOD, voting, proxies, quorums, etc.
Hope this helps.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Nancy
Having lived in 5 HOA's, I have never seen anyone get elected to the BOD without having proxies voting for them. Also, I have never seen a person nominated from the floor ever obtain enough votes to be elected.
Sometimes the game is won or lost via betting even before the game is played.
Hope this helps.
Having lived in 5 HOA's, I have never seen anyone get elected to the BOD without having proxies voting for them. Also, I have never seen a person nominated from the floor ever obtain enough votes to be elected.
Sometimes the game is won or lost via betting even before the game is played.
Hope this helps.
BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535
Posts: 2,535
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NancyG3 on 07/26/2012 12:49 PM
Thanks Bruce: Our bylaws do provide for nominations from the floor, however, in times past the people that want to run their information was sent out to the homeowners prior to the meeting. The present Board has not ever done this and this is one of the reason we can't get them out of office.
Most of the people believe the proxy is the ballot. No specific instructions have ever been placed on our proxy.
Thanks Bruce: Our bylaws do provide for nominations from the floor, however, in times past the people that want to run their information was sent out to the homeowners prior to the meeting. The present Board has not ever done this and this is one of the reason we can't get them out of office.
Most of the people believe the proxy is the ballot. No specific instructions have ever been placed on our proxy.
Proxies are not absentee ballots. Someone needs to educate your homeowners. The instructions do not have to be on the proxy. They can simply be verbal instructions given to the person whom you trust that you have designated to be your proxy.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Bruce
While I agree that proxies are not absentee ballots, when they list whom to vote for one might argue they are not much different when it comes to counting the votes then an absentee ballot is.
When the countin is done (wait..I hear a song there...LOL) 24 designated proxie ballot votes Bruce is not much different then 24 absentee ballot votes for Bruce.
I realize a proxy can also assign someone to vote for me any way they so desire, or for anyone but Bruce, but types of proxies is another issue.
An aside. Proxies are not allowed by our Bylaws and that will be one thing we will have the declarant change before we take over.
Pssssstttttt..vote for anyone but Bruce...LOL
While I agree that proxies are not absentee ballots, when they list whom to vote for one might argue they are not much different when it comes to counting the votes then an absentee ballot is.
When the countin is done (wait..I hear a song there...LOL) 24 designated proxie ballot votes Bruce is not much different then 24 absentee ballot votes for Bruce.
I realize a proxy can also assign someone to vote for me any way they so desire, or for anyone but Bruce, but types of proxies is another issue.
An aside. Proxies are not allowed by our Bylaws and that will be one thing we will have the declarant change before we take over.
Pssssstttttt..vote for anyone but Bruce...LOL
BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535
Posts: 2,535
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnC46 on 07/26/2012 2:08 PM
Bruce
While I agree that proxies are not absentee ballots, when they list whom to vote for one might argue they are not much different when it comes to counting the votes then an absentee ballot is.
Bruce
While I agree that proxies are not absentee ballots, when they list whom to vote for one might argue they are not much different when it comes to counting the votes then an absentee ballot is.
John,
My interpretation of Nancy's description of her HOA's proxy form is that the member can choose one of the listed board members to be the proxy, or write in the name of someone else they choose (read her posts again). However, I can see where some might easily be confused and assume that the names listed (board members) are candidates for office (which they may be). Actually, quite a clever way to insure continually getting elected since the designated proxy (a board member) will of course vote for the existing board members.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Bruce
I agree. Clever and as I said, while not wrong it is a slight of hand.
Psssttt...maybe vote for Bruce..LOL
I agree. Clever and as I said, while not wrong it is a slight of hand.
Psssttt...maybe vote for Bruce..LOL
BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535
Posts: 2,535
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnC46 on 07/26/2012 2:38 PM
That's how scam artists work.
CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
It's a huge reason why we have write-in ballots counting towards quorum in Cali. Our HOA doesn't use proxies & they're outta our Bylaws soon! WE have no trouble making quorum. I recall someone else saying proxies aren't even permitted in AZ.
NancyG3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 342
Posts: 342
Posted:
John it does help and you are right but, in our Assn there are more Proxies than people that attend, this is how the Board keeps themselves in or nobody else will run for the Board. However, we have 2 other people running with the 3 present Board members whose term is up. I know these 2 people and I feel they would be an asset. Our financial statement has raised a lot of questions and I thought if this could be brought up before the voting it may sway some of the people attending to vote at least 1 of the present Board members out. I guess I will have to wait and see what happens. No I am not running for the Board. I was on the original Board and served 3 terms and things happened where I would not like to be on with this present Board as they do not follow the By-Laws and Covenants. I appreciate you input. You seem to be very knowable with HOA problems. You and Lawrence have helped a lot.
NancyG3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 342
Posts: 342
Posted:
Thanks Carol, however, the NC Planned Community Act has Proxies, therefore, our By-Laws have Proxies. Wish we could only have Ballots. Thank for your input.
NancyG3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 342
Posts: 342
Posted:
Sorry - I typed Lawrence instead of Bruce. I meant both John and Bruce have helped a lot.
NancyG3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 342
Posts: 342
Posted:
Bruce I so agree.
LOL......John & Bruce Pssst how about voting for Nancy....LOL
No thank you.
LOL......John & Bruce Pssst how about voting for Nancy....LOL
No thank you.
JeanI (Louisiana)
Posts: 112
Posts: 112
Posted:
Sounds as though you have a major communication problem. You may want to change from proxy voting to absentee voting. Check the Sterling-Davis website for details. JMI
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Personally I like proxies. Allow me to explain why.
Absentee ballots assume the person gets one and returns it. Easy enough to mail one to each owner. Returning them is another issue and generally the same apathy sets in as not showing up to vote. They do not return them.
Proxies can be solicited and collected by people going around, talking to other owners, and collecting their proxy. They are a more immediate, will you help us, issues can be discussed, etc.
Proxies can also be changed. I can sign one dated today and give it to you to vote for me but then a few days later I could sign a different one and the last signed one is the one that will be counted.
I like proxies. All the major changes I ever witnessed in HOA's happened because some folks cared, went out in the neighborhood, had open houses, set up tables at the pool, etc. They talked, explained, collected proxies, and made changes.
I am a proxy kind of guy...LOL
Absentee ballots assume the person gets one and returns it. Easy enough to mail one to each owner. Returning them is another issue and generally the same apathy sets in as not showing up to vote. They do not return them.
Proxies can be solicited and collected by people going around, talking to other owners, and collecting their proxy. They are a more immediate, will you help us, issues can be discussed, etc.
Proxies can also be changed. I can sign one dated today and give it to you to vote for me but then a few days later I could sign a different one and the last signed one is the one that will be counted.
I like proxies. All the major changes I ever witnessed in HOA's happened because some folks cared, went out in the neighborhood, had open houses, set up tables at the pool, etc. They talked, explained, collected proxies, and made changes.
I am a proxy kind of guy...LOL
CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
Besides proxy stuff in the NC Planned Community Act , what ELSE does it say about elections, Nancy??
How long before an election (an annual meeting in NC?) must Owners receive ballots? Surely the day of the election isn't permitted, is it??
What must ("shall") be on the ballots? Names of candidates? What sort of voting instructions??
What is defined as a quorum of Members (Owners), or do your documents define quorum for electing directors, e.g., 25% of all lots?
Along with proxies, are write-in (absentee) ballots permitted as they are in CA?
The correct site is davis-sterling.com, but it only applies to CA, which has election laws that truly protect Homeowners. Still, it might be a good model for your HOA in the future if not conflicting with your own state laws.
Our HOA is 43% landlords (absentee owners), so door-to-door electioneering wouldn't do a lot of good whether for votes or for proxies. And would likely annoy renters.
Our Bylaws' quorum requirement is 25% of lots. Of our 213 units, generally 80-90 votes, so, because absentee ballots are permitted in CA, we easily make quorum without proxies.
How long before an election (an annual meeting in NC?) must Owners receive ballots? Surely the day of the election isn't permitted, is it??
What must ("shall") be on the ballots? Names of candidates? What sort of voting instructions??
What is defined as a quorum of Members (Owners), or do your documents define quorum for electing directors, e.g., 25% of all lots?
Along with proxies, are write-in (absentee) ballots permitted as they are in CA?
The correct site is davis-sterling.com, but it only applies to CA, which has election laws that truly protect Homeowners. Still, it might be a good model for your HOA in the future if not conflicting with your own state laws.
Our HOA is 43% landlords (absentee owners), so door-to-door electioneering wouldn't do a lot of good whether for votes or for proxies. And would likely annoy renters.
Our Bylaws' quorum requirement is 25% of lots. Of our 213 units, generally 80-90 votes, so, because absentee ballots are permitted in CA, we easily make quorum without proxies.
BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535
Posts: 2,535
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JeanI on 07/29/2012 11:49 AM
Sounds as though you have a major communication problem. You may want to change from proxy voting to absentee voting. Check the Sterling-Davis website for details. JMI
Sounds as though you have a major communication problem. You may want to change from proxy voting to absentee voting. Check the Sterling-Davis website for details. JMI
Sterling-Davis doesn't apply to Nancy's HOA. She's in North Carolina.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Carol
One could discuss a proxy with an absentee owner and sent it to them for them to sign and return.
Personally I am not comfortable with any less then 50% (and preferably 66%) being able to change Covenants/Bylaws. With your numbers, a minority could rule the majority.
One could discuss a proxy with an absentee owner and sent it to them for them to sign and return.
Personally I am not comfortable with any less then 50% (and preferably 66%) being able to change Covenants/Bylaws. With your numbers, a minority could rule the majority.
CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
Nancy, Let's go back to Original Post. You wrote that the prez sent a letter that "raised many questions" among Owners. Can you tell us the gist of the letter? Do you know why the later came only from the president and not from the entire Board? I agree with John that somewhere in your own governing docs, probably your bylaws, there are specify election rules or procedures. What are they?
Bruce, are you saying that in your state, Association members do not know who's on the ballot until the annual meeting? Simply because there may be nominations from the floor??
John, public elections are, as you know, conducted all of the time when numerous registered voters do not vote. The winner often is elected by a minority of those who are qualified to vote. The winner only needs a majority of those who did vote in order to win. If the majority is "silent," so be it.
There are many reasons voters don't vote. Chief among them are that some voters don't have a preference--they see the choices as equally bad or equally OK.
Others are apathetic; they don't care for a variety of reasons.
Our HOA--and many others-- function in the same way. All voters receive ballots with the candidate listed and a "Candidates Statement" from each. They receive double envelopes so that their vote is secret.
What's different than public elections is that we require a quorum of 25% of all lots present in person or by absentee ballot for elections of directors.
Until our new Bylaws are accepted by the voters, which at present requires a simple majority of all lots to approve, members may vote by proxy. No one does anymore because they may vote by mail. We want to eliminate proxy voting. For one thing, it adds expense to the mailings that we must send out with the ballots. For another, according to you yourself, John, it adds that wink-wink, "slight of hand" element that seems unpleasant to me.
To contact absentee owners for their proxies is, of course, possible, but in CA, we may only give out names and addresses of owners, not phone #s or email addresses. Some campaigns have involved candidates individually or as a slate mailing campaign materials to Owners. This may not be done at the HOA's expense.
Bruce, are you saying that in your state, Association members do not know who's on the ballot until the annual meeting? Simply because there may be nominations from the floor??
John, public elections are, as you know, conducted all of the time when numerous registered voters do not vote. The winner often is elected by a minority of those who are qualified to vote. The winner only needs a majority of those who did vote in order to win. If the majority is "silent," so be it.
There are many reasons voters don't vote. Chief among them are that some voters don't have a preference--they see the choices as equally bad or equally OK.
Others are apathetic; they don't care for a variety of reasons.
Our HOA--and many others-- function in the same way. All voters receive ballots with the candidate listed and a "Candidates Statement" from each. They receive double envelopes so that their vote is secret.
What's different than public elections is that we require a quorum of 25% of all lots present in person or by absentee ballot for elections of directors.
Until our new Bylaws are accepted by the voters, which at present requires a simple majority of all lots to approve, members may vote by proxy. No one does anymore because they may vote by mail. We want to eliminate proxy voting. For one thing, it adds expense to the mailings that we must send out with the ballots. For another, according to you yourself, John, it adds that wink-wink, "slight of hand" element that seems unpleasant to me.
To contact absentee owners for their proxies is, of course, possible, but in CA, we may only give out names and addresses of owners, not phone #s or email addresses. Some campaigns have involved candidates individually or as a slate mailing campaign materials to Owners. This may not be done at the HOA's expense.
NancyG3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 342
Posts: 342
Posted:
Carol - I've answered your questions under the paragraph you wrote.
"Can you tell us the gist of the letter? Do you know why the later came only from the president and not from the entire Board? I agree with John that somewhere in your own governing docs, probably your bylaws, there are specify election rules or procedures. What are they?"
This is going to take some space. One of the people running for the Board sent a letter out to the homeowners giving his platform, and listing his Priorities,then he listed what his priorities were based on. Stating - We are broke and he can prove it. Along with other things about accountability needed. The Presidents letter sent by email started with To: Wyndfall-An inflamamatory letter. He primarily refuted everything the person wrote regarding the money. (but the Pres is wrong because I saw the year end accountants report) What the Pres neglected to say was that most of the money he mentioned was prepaid 2012 dues. The only thing I can think of as to why it came from the Pres is he has all the email addresses. As to election rules, under Nomination and Election of Directors in our by-laws Nomination for election to the BOD shall be made by a Nominating Committe (NC). Nominations may also be made from the floor at the annual meeting of the members of the Assn. The NC shall consist of a Chairman, who shall be a member of the BOD and two or more members of the Assn. The NC shall be appointed by the BOD. There is more about how long the NC serves and they shall make as many nominations to the BOD as it shall in its discretion and only nominations may be made only from among Members. (There was no Nominating Committee this year per the Secretary.) We do have Proxy votes and must be handed in to Secretary prior to meeting. Cumulative voting shall not be permitted. Under Election: Election to the BOD shall be by secret ballot at the annual meeting. At such election the members or their proxies may case (I beleive this is a mispelling and should be cast), in respect to each vacancy, as many votes as they are entitled to exercise under the Declaration. The persons receiving the largest number of votes shall be elected. Cumulative voting is not permitted.
Your question to Bruce - Our Assn does not know who is running for the Board until the day of the meeting other than the present Board which is told in our local biased newsletter. This is why the 2 people running for the Board sent out their own letters to the homeowners.
Our By-Laws state the presence of members or of proxies entitled to cast forty percent (40%) of all votes shall constitute a quorum. Hope I've answered your questions.
"Can you tell us the gist of the letter? Do you know why the later came only from the president and not from the entire Board? I agree with John that somewhere in your own governing docs, probably your bylaws, there are specify election rules or procedures. What are they?"
This is going to take some space. One of the people running for the Board sent a letter out to the homeowners giving his platform, and listing his Priorities,then he listed what his priorities were based on. Stating - We are broke and he can prove it. Along with other things about accountability needed. The Presidents letter sent by email started with To: Wyndfall-An inflamamatory letter. He primarily refuted everything the person wrote regarding the money. (but the Pres is wrong because I saw the year end accountants report) What the Pres neglected to say was that most of the money he mentioned was prepaid 2012 dues. The only thing I can think of as to why it came from the Pres is he has all the email addresses. As to election rules, under Nomination and Election of Directors in our by-laws Nomination for election to the BOD shall be made by a Nominating Committe (NC). Nominations may also be made from the floor at the annual meeting of the members of the Assn. The NC shall consist of a Chairman, who shall be a member of the BOD and two or more members of the Assn. The NC shall be appointed by the BOD. There is more about how long the NC serves and they shall make as many nominations to the BOD as it shall in its discretion and only nominations may be made only from among Members. (There was no Nominating Committee this year per the Secretary.) We do have Proxy votes and must be handed in to Secretary prior to meeting. Cumulative voting shall not be permitted. Under Election: Election to the BOD shall be by secret ballot at the annual meeting. At such election the members or their proxies may case (I beleive this is a mispelling and should be cast), in respect to each vacancy, as many votes as they are entitled to exercise under the Declaration. The persons receiving the largest number of votes shall be elected. Cumulative voting is not permitted.
Your question to Bruce - Our Assn does not know who is running for the Board until the day of the meeting other than the present Board which is told in our local biased newsletter. This is why the 2 people running for the Board sent out their own letters to the homeowners.
Our By-Laws state the presence of members or of proxies entitled to cast forty percent (40%) of all votes shall constitute a quorum. Hope I've answered your questions.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Carol
John, public elections are, as you know, conducted all of the time when numerous registered voters do not vote. The winner often is elected by a minority of those who are qualified to vote. The winner only needs a majority of those who did vote in order to win. If the majority is "silent," so be it.
I agree with this. I was refering to changing Covenants/Bylaws.
The slight of hand was not a proxy issue by itself. It was someone sending proxies out and some people thinking it was a ballot. Whose fault was that?
Even then it makes no difference per se. If returned they were counted. If not returned they did not count. When it come to counting, I see no difference between proxies and ballots. They are both voting vehicles.
John, public elections are, as you know, conducted all of the time when numerous registered voters do not vote. The winner often is elected by a minority of those who are qualified to vote. The winner only needs a majority of those who did vote in order to win. If the majority is "silent," so be it.
I agree with this. I was refering to changing Covenants/Bylaws.
The slight of hand was not a proxy issue by itself. It was someone sending proxies out and some people thinking it was a ballot. Whose fault was that?
Even then it makes no difference per se. If returned they were counted. If not returned they did not count. When it come to counting, I see no difference between proxies and ballots. They are both voting vehicles.
NancyG3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 342
Posts: 342
Posted:
Bruce what I should have said is noone knows who is running for a position on the Board when the Proxies are mailed out.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Nancy
Most associations are doing away with or ignoring Nominating Committee. Some are using them to simply verify that all wanting to run for the BOD are qualified to do so. The way they do this is the association puts out a notice about upcoming elections and ask anyone wishing to run to notify the committee.
Some information:
Florida has separate rules for condo and homeowners associations. "For condos, nominating committees are no longer permitted," says Dennis J. Eisinger, a partner at Eisinger, Brown, Lewis & Frankel PA in Hollywood, Fla., who currently represents more than 500 condo and HOA associations. "It's a self nomination process. For HOAs, you can still have them, but you can't preclude nominations from the floor."
Even though nominating committees are permitted in Florida HOAs, they're rarely employed. "I've never heard of nominating committees before," says Robert White, managing director of KW Property Management & Consulting in Miami, which oversees about 135 Florida associations totaling 30,000-35,000 units. "Typically the way it works in Florida is that we send a mailing to the entire community telling them the board's coming up for election. If they want to run, they need to provide a resume and other materials we can send out to the members so they can vote accordingly."
California's Davis-Stirling Act, which governs community associations, has eliminated the role of nominating committees by allowing candidates who qualify for board membership to throw their hat into the ring without the consent of any committee.
Seems the day and age of the Nominating Committee is over.
Most associations are doing away with or ignoring Nominating Committee. Some are using them to simply verify that all wanting to run for the BOD are qualified to do so. The way they do this is the association puts out a notice about upcoming elections and ask anyone wishing to run to notify the committee.
Some information:
Florida has separate rules for condo and homeowners associations. "For condos, nominating committees are no longer permitted," says Dennis J. Eisinger, a partner at Eisinger, Brown, Lewis & Frankel PA in Hollywood, Fla., who currently represents more than 500 condo and HOA associations. "It's a self nomination process. For HOAs, you can still have them, but you can't preclude nominations from the floor."
Even though nominating committees are permitted in Florida HOAs, they're rarely employed. "I've never heard of nominating committees before," says Robert White, managing director of KW Property Management & Consulting in Miami, which oversees about 135 Florida associations totaling 30,000-35,000 units. "Typically the way it works in Florida is that we send a mailing to the entire community telling them the board's coming up for election. If they want to run, they need to provide a resume and other materials we can send out to the members so they can vote accordingly."
California's Davis-Stirling Act, which governs community associations, has eliminated the role of nominating committees by allowing candidates who qualify for board membership to throw their hat into the ring without the consent of any committee.
Seems the day and age of the Nominating Committee is over.
NancyG3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 342
Posts: 342
Posted:
Thanks John - This was good information. I scanned the NC PCA and the NC Nonprofit Corp Act and didn't find anything in it regarding nominating committees. I will check into it more. However, our By-Laws still have it. (Our Covenants and By-Laws have never been updated. Our CC&R's were filed in 2000 and Incorporated at the same time.) I think our BOD decided to just not have a Nominating Committee. (I don't have a problem with it because for past years nobody wanted to be a Board member.)
Thanks everyone for your input. I think I can put my forum to rest. It was all good information, some I knew and some I learned about. You folk are very knowledgeable.
Thanks everyone for your input. I think I can put my forum to rest. It was all good information, some I knew and some I learned about. You folk are very knowledgeable.
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