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BabetteM (Hawaii)
Posts: 12
Posted:
Our self-managed HOA has been very loosely run for many years. The new Board is in the process of writing up Rules of Procedures for all Board Officers and Committees. I'm working on the Treasurer's Rules, although I have no background in finance. My question is this: We have a budget that is approved annually. When bills come in and the Treasurer makes sure that there is sufficient money in the line item to pay that bill (legal fees, for example), does the Board still have to approve each check before it is written? Some people feel that since the Board approved the budget, then they don't need to approve each expenditure as long as there's still money in the budget. I still feel that the Board should approve each expenditure before writing the checks. Appreciate your advise!
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
They should approve and discuss it in an OPEN meeting with members. A budget is just an OUTLINE of the HOA's budget just to make sure the HOa has some borders/controls. Every expense should be discussed prior to approval. If it is a routine cost then just mention it is routine utilities, water etc...Unless it at an unusual cost.

We had a two signature system on ALL checks. Two officers and the Accountant/treasurer had to sign each check. Checks did not get written out until approved by the board. It is checks and balances.

collections are private matters between the person that owes and the HOA board. Just a general idea of collections should be enough. We always referred accounts behind not by names but by lot #. It gives some privacy even if everyone may know who they are.

Just make sure not to keep members informed.

Former HOA President
LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By BabetteM on 07/24/2012 1:03 PM
When bills come in and the Treasurer makes sure that there is sufficient money in the line item to pay that bill (legal fees, for example), does the Board still have to approve each check before it is written? Some people feel that since the Board approved the budget, then they don't need to approve each expenditure as long as there's still money in the budget. I still feel that the Board should approve each expenditure before writing the checks.

If the board already approved spending on an item, just what is to be debated when the bill for that item comes due?

For example: You approve the expense and budget money for someone to mow the lawns. The person mows the lawn and sends you an invoice. Why should this be in front of the board again? Are you going to do this at every meeting?

The only good thing about this idea is that it keeps the board's wheels spinning on old business, limiting its time to screw up other stuff. Come to think of it, yes, this is a really good idea. Do it!
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Not to put words in Mel's mouth....but I think she is saying checks and balance.

Seems with all we read about association fraud, what allowed them to do such was no checks and balances. The BOD either trusting to much, asleep at the helm, or both.

Trust...but...verifty.

BjS (Florida)
Posts: 16
Posted:
I am the HOA treasurer and act as the watchdog over the management company's bookkeeping. They receive the invoices, they issue the checks, I review all and the checks are signed by me and another board member.

We do not discuss every invoice. If it was considered in the budget (and you must know what was discussed and considered) there is no reason to go over every single item. Every board member gets the Balance Sheet, Income & Expense, Cash Disbursement (with copies of checks), and Bank statements with reconcillaton five days before the meeting. It is easy for them to see what was spent & where.

The line items are for budget planning purposes and to keep us on track throughout the year. But the money is in one big pile, you will go over in one line item and under in another and they will wash each other out.

Mistakes or questions get researched and corrected by me. Anything totally unexpected is always reported to the board via e-mail before the meeting and decisions if needed at the next meeting (if not an emergency). I will never sign a check from reserves on the president’s word (can’t stop him, but I won’t) – Reserves expenditures must have a board vote and verified in the minutes.

Accounts with collection problems are in front of the board with house number and name: and brief status but they are numbered 1, 2, 3 etc and if discussed that number is used as reference. It is our way of not giving the audience a hint of who we are talking about. It is funny to watch the members try to figure it out. But in the minutes the unit number is used without a name. Doesn’t’ change much because it is all official record open for inspection by members.

At the meeting a general report of the status of the operating & reserve accounts is written and read for the audience, including the net uncollected dollars for the fiscal year and cumulative. That is always a shocker. If we are going over budget in a line item it is read. Then the board and members are allowed to ask questions.
Hope this helps.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I did mean checks and balances... I was using my google TV remote to post and can't always type everything I want to say on it...Just wanted to clarify what I meant by going over even every day items. It's NOT dwelling on the regular accounts like utilities, water, and insurance. They would get mentioned if the expense had changed or could be changed.

Example: Our water bill was well over $100 a month. Which is pretty high for our area. What was happening was the pool person would come fill up the pool and leave the hose to the pool running. They would leave and a few hours later I would find it running and turn it off. That is IF I caught it. The water could run for most of the day at times. A point I brought up when members questioned why the bill was soo high. It was because of this, we were able to purchase a cheap $30 timer for the water at the pool. It would automatically turn the water off after 60 minutes and couldn't be turned on without turning on the timer. This cut our bill nearly in half.

It is these small every day items that can open up discussions of saving some money or other options. This allowed us to review our insurance policy every so often as a new member might question it. Even every day and budgetted items can use another look every once and awhile. Even if it is to remind us to get back to basics....

Former HOA President
KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239
Posted:
Babette,

Let the treasurer pay the regular monthly bills and have the board receive a list of the checks that are issued each month as well as an open policy for dues payers. There must be some measure of trust that board members aren't inherently corrupt. You back that up with a yearly audit that's open to dues payer review.

We are not self-managed but our property manager can issue checks for regular monthly payments and repairs up to $500 if urgent or "emergency." Otherwise the board steps in. That covers a pipe leak or other trouble that will cause great damage if not immediately addressed when discovered - meetings aside.
BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535
Posted:
I don't think it should be necessary to micromanage the treasurer. That person has been given a job and that person's job is to insure that the invoices received are within the budget. If the board is going to review, debate, and approve every invoice to be paid, then you don't need a treasurer other than to fill some bylaw requirement that you have a body to fill the position of treasurer. Actually, your bylaws should say what the treasurer's job is. The treasurer should report to the board at each meeting the financial status of the HOA and whether or not he expects the HOA to remain on budget. If the treasurer feels that, based on his experience during the year, a potion of the money earmarked for one budget line item should be transferred to another line item, then that issue should be brought by the treasurer before the board to be debated and voted on. It is the treasurer's job to keep the board informed.

In all the organizations I have ever been in and the boards I have served on, including HOAs, whatever my position, whenever I was given a budget for the purposes of my position, I never had to explain or obtain approval for every expenditure. Only when an expenditure would cause me to exceed my budget was I required to seek approval before making the expenditure.
JonD1
Posts: 2,350
Posted:
I too see no reason why one would waste time going through EACH expenditure handled through the Board. As Board members we are each provided with a check ledger in our packet each month detailing each check written. And as some have suggested many are routine month to month costs.

We have the MC write out checks and those checks are mailed to the Treasurer with a copy of the invoice. The MC signs the checks and the Treasurer, afer verifying the checks, also signs them and mails them out.
2 signatures required on ALL checks.

The MC, Treasurer, President and VP all have on-line access to our accounts and can review any detail of our banking.

IMO more than enough oversight without taking the time to review, explain, discuss, and approve each check being issued.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
We have a two signature rule on each check issued.
Payments for utilities, installments on existing contracts (trash, landscape, etc.), and normal administrative expenses (postage, printing) do not require approval but all require receipts/invoice.

Other line items in the budget (tree trimming, legal expenses, etc.) are not expended unless the board authorizes the expense in it's meeting (i.e. The board authorized the President to contact the attorney, the Board authorizes the maintenance officer to have tree trimmed/removed). Again, all checks issued require invoices for these type of things.

Hope this helps,

Tim
BabetteM (Hawaii)
Posts: 12
Posted:
Thanks, all, for your responses. Been very helpful. Luckily we already have a lot of the "checks and balances" in place, such as requiring two signatures on checks, and I think with this latest input from the forum I know where to go from here.

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