APPROVAL OF MINUTES OF MINUTES

Started by BrianB11 • 8 replies • 1522 views

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BrianB11 (California)
Posts: 6

Posted:

We have a situation where the board will not approve the March minutes. It is over an amendment to the minutes which the vote splits 2-2 1 abstain and the same for the minutes. This is a California HOA. How do you get "official" minutes or do they just remain unapproved and uncertified?

Thank you.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Brian,

If the vote is tied on amending the minutes, then the amendment failed.

I would suggest including the amendment within the new meeting minutes or as an attachment to the old minutes. Then show the vote. This may appease the board members as their voice would have been heard.

Otherwise, to my understanding, the minutes should be filed with the records and noted as unapproved. however, every effort should be made to have them approved.

For more clarification, there is a Roberts Rules of Order discussion group I located that may be able to provide additional options.

Out of curiosity, why did the one person abstain?

CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563

Posted:

Brian, Welcome to the Forum!

Like Tim, I'm curious about the abstention too. Was the director absent at the meeting that the minutes recorded? But those who were absent are permitted to vote on the minutes--at least that's my understanding.

Can you tell us the content of the amendment?

Minutes may be brought back to the Board as, I guess, Unfinished Business, and you can try again.

For now, though, in Calif. they must be available for your HOA Members to review if they wish and must be kept as part of your records. Since the minutes are not approved, however, Members may not have copies of them.

(As you can tell, I'm not feeling entirely at home with this subject.)

In case you're not familiar with it, Brian, davis-sterling.com is an excellent site and can answer a lot of your HOA questions!

BrianB11 (California)
Posts: 6

Posted:

This has been going on for two months. In April, two members wanted to make an amendment to the March Meeting and it did not pass 2-2 one board member absent. Consequently, the vote to approve the minutes was then 2-2 also.

In May, the amendment was brought up again as all 5 members were present. The vote was 2-2-1 abstain primarily because the member was not present at the first meeting and also thought it was primarily a pissing contest between the two factions (maybe it was). The amendment failed again and this board member also decided to abstain when the approval of the minutes came to a vote which was also 2*2-a abstain.

The April minutes were approved. So, we are at a situation where the March Minutes have not been approved by the board nor certified as official by the secretary. Assuming this continues, do the minutes just stay unapproved or are they required to be certified as unapproved or what?

Thank you.

BrianB11 (California)
Posts: 6

Posted:

I have been looking at that davis-sterling and thought I found an answer a couple of months ago but can't find it now. Maybe in my dreams! We circulate the "draft" minutes to the association in the next months billing so the "official" minutes are never seen by the association anyway unless one asks.

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202

Posted:

Brian - April minutes should not be approved until the March ones are.

What is the issue? What could there be in minutes that is so controversial that this group cannot agree that it happened?

I have a feeling that your minutes are too full of opinions and gonna-dos, instead of the actual business of the meeting, and so people are arguing about things that should not even be in the minutes.

CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563

Posted:

Brian, Susan says more clearly what I was trying to learn from you when I asked about the nature of the amendment.

Is your board quibbling about something that shouldn't even be in the minutes? The "actual business of the meeting" as Susan puts it, comprises statements of the motions, the seconds, the votes. In Calif., as you know, Brian, only items on the agenda may be discussed, debated, and voted on by the Board (with few exceptions).

BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535

Posted:

Brian,

I agree with Susan. It does sound like your board may be arguing about something that shouldn't be part of the minutes anyway.

1. The minutes are a record of the items on the agenda that were covered and the actions taken. It is not a record of any discussion that took place.

2. There is no such thing as an "amendment" to the minutes. There may be corrections to the minutes (with regard to what actions took place, or who presented a motion, etc., but there are no "amendments."

3. Are you saying your board cannot agree on what they did? A motion was either made or it wasn't. It was either passed or it didn't. If a motion was amended, the amendment should have been voted on separately and it either passed or it didn't.

So, what's the issue?

BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535

Posted:

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