MEMBER DEMANDING COPIES OF MINUTES

OUR HOMEOWNERS ASSN HAS BEEN INVOLVED IN A LAWSUIT FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS AND IT IS JUST ABOUT TO BE RESOLVED AND I FEEL, STRONGLY, THAT IT WILL SWING IN OUR FAVOR. THE PERSON THAT FILED AGAINST US HAS SINCE ABANDONED THE PROPERTY. ONE OF OUR OTHER MEMBERS, WHO I FEEL HAS BEEN IN TOUCH WITH THE PERSON WHO FILED ON US, HAS DEMANDED THAT WE GIVE HIM COPIES OF THE MINUTES OF THE BOARD MEETINGS FROM OCTOBER, 2006 BACKWARDS. AS PRESIDENT AND WITH THE STRONG FEELING I HAVE THAT HE IS AIDING THE PERSON THAT FILED SUIT AGAINST US, I HAVE ASKED THE SECRETARY NOT TO PROVIDE HIM WITH THIS UNLESS HE CAN GIVE US A REASON WHY HE HAS REQUESTED THESE MINUTES. PLEASE TELL ME IF I AM IN MY RIGHT TO DO SO.BOTH THE PERSON WHO FILED ON US AND THIS INDIVIDUAL WHO IS REQUESTING THE MINUTES HAVE BEEN SEVERE TROUBLE MAKERS FOR YEARS.

ROGER B, WHAT WOULD YOU CONSIDER TO BE A REASONABLE FEE FOR
PROVIDING THE MINUTES TO A HOMEOWNER?

Linda, we charge $0.15/page copied, mailing cost when applicable, and our fee of $35.00/hour for time involved in pulling files, refiling, and overseeing as records are inspected. Wwe never leave client alone with files because we are the responsible custodian. Also, from experience we have learned to require payment when or before providing the services requested.

LindaR,

You have denied one of your members access to minutes because you are assuming to know the intent of the member (currently residing) that has requested the minutes. That is unacceptable in my book regardless as to their supposedly being a "troublemaker".

Follow the procedure without bias.

Regardless as to the reason you should provide the minutes at a nominal cost per page for reproduction and at the very least provide access to the minutes with reasonable notice to ALL members of the community you serve.

GeraldT1
NNJ

LindaR

I recommend that you review the applicable law in your state. If your property owners association (POA) is organized as a nonprofit corporation, the nonprofit act in your state may require that minutes and other books and records be made available to members. For example, the Michigan Nonprofit Corporation Act requires in §487 that minutes and other records be available to members "for proper purpose". "Proper purpose" could be as simple as for the member to be informed about the stewardship by the board.

Your governing documents may also require that specified records including minutes be available to members. The "golden thread" in public policy is reflected in the Freedom of Information and Open Meetings Acts which require that almost all records be available to members. Some states have adopted similar requirements for POAs. Those principles are good policy for POAs.

As a matter of policy, hiding records is poor policy. It breeds distrust and implies a cover up. If the board has acted properly and the minutes document proper exercise of fiduciary duty, the minutes are your "friend".

As a practical matter, the minutes would likely have to be produced by court order in discovery in any litigation. Providing the minutes now may help persuade the member that the board has acted properly and prevent this member for joining in any litigation.

I agree with Don. I may be preachng to the choir here. However, FYI, my state, Florida is taking more of a transparency stand now, after years of Boards hiding things from homeowners. Here in Florida, the statutes require the Association to produce minutes financial records, and other evidence of what they do. Our Board just forced an increase in budget and assessment on the homeowners, while they carry over tens of thousands in extra cash and pad several budget items. When homeowners demanded to see the expenditures to justify this, the Property Manager and President were on the phone to the attorneys within minutes for excuses to deny homeowners the right to see expenditures such as postage, legal fees, and now pay records. Homeowners pay the staff. So the Property Manager and President lie, and the attorney swears to it, at least verbally.

Try taking that to court, though. See if the attorney will own up to what he told you over the phone in front of the judge.

In refusing to be transpanent, it sends a signal to homeowners that the Board has things to hide, messy financial records, actions taken their backs, and the like. That is how our homeowenrs feel right now. They are lied to constantly, then denied rights through new rules, then denied access to records to have any indication of what is going on.

The sad part is, several of the Association law firms condone and encourage this behavior. When homeowners find something wrong, the attorneys will tell them "You don't like it? Challenge it!" and try to send everyone into years of court proceedings, with huge legal fees for the homeowners and the Association. Twin Rivers (NJ) homeowners took their Board to court over too many rules. The homeowners got a law school attorney to work for them for free. The Association, meanwhile, told their homeowners it would likely cost them over $200,000 to defend the Association, and come out their hides as assessments. Last I heard, it had cost them over $500,000. They refused to listen to, or negotiate with, the people who own the Association.

To me, the more open the Board is about its activities, the better. It gives the owners more confidence that issues and actions are out in the open, even if they disagree with what the Board does. If they don't like the Board, they get rid of it, which is one reason why some Boards these days hide things. I know a Property Manager who lies and spins everything he does to keep his job. The homeowners hate him, and want him out.

ArthurG

I encourage all associations to post their records on a section of a secure website available only to their members. Then it is available for any member to view and download as they please. And to post their public and other controlling documents on a public section available to everyone. That helps prospective buyer and their real estate agents as well as the association. As Dr. Phil says "those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing."

Linda:

Even though you have the right to ask what their reason is for asking, does it really matter? Even if that had evil intentions I doubt they would share them with you. Inform them of the charges for making copies and proceed with their request if they approve.

Linda,
Since our annual elections are approaching I wrote and asked our manager to provide me with the Boards tenure dates. I was told it is two, two, and one and this year it is one.
I rewrote and asked again which members come off when. The reply was I don't thing I understand your question.
I haven't learned how they want me to act so I guess it is "nose to nose" again. Shame.

Any reason why things like Board meeting minutes should only be available to members? I had somebody today who told me that Board minutes should be available to the general public as part of the info that they would use to decide if they want to be part of our group.

Dwight, that is up to the association. I do not recommend it because there can be sensitive or semi-private info in minutes. However, we do provide minutes and other HOA information to sellers to give to potential buyers. Meanwhile the controlling document, which all knowledgeable buyers will read before making an offer, can be published on a public page of a website.