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GuyF (Michigan)
Posts: 8
Posted:
Is it normal and proper for a POA to have a closed meeting prior to every public monthly board meeting? This has been going on for about 7 years now, ever since the current president was elected. MANY if not all of the residents have grown angrier at the lack of transparency and secrecy shown by this current board.
BTW we are located in Michigan
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
There was a recent thread on this forum about open meetings in Michigan. Perhaps it will help shed some light on the subject:

Open Meetings Act / Michigan
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
Normal procedure is to motion for the board to go into Executive Session after a regular board meeting, and then for a specific topic (legal issues, discipline, contract negotiation)

At the next meeting, you might remind the board that all discussions of the board need to be held in open forum (in front of those members in attendance) and that if they go into ES, the motion must be made and the purpose stated.

(Are you suspecting that they are conducting other business in this meeting? perhaps colluding about motions to prevent open discussion?)
GuyF (Michigan)
Posts: 8
Posted:
Well the board would only have a closed door meeting prior to a regular meeting once in a great while IF there was an issue that needed attention as back then most of the board members were just weekend residents and it was too hard to try and resolve an issue over the noise of the crowd. BUT this new board will meet one week prior to the regular POA meeting, and they decide then how they are going to vote on issues, it is like a rehearsal for the main event.
BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186
Posted:
Your Board members must have more time on their hands than I do. I have a hard enough time squeezing in the regular Board Meeting. (I am retired but very busy)
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
Remind them that there must be open discussion about all HOA business and them "getting together" to discuss HOA business before a meeting does constitue a "meeting."

Even "work sessions" must be announced and held in open forum.

Sounds like your board meetings are getting too long and the board wants to cut out all pre-discussion of issues. But in reality, new ideas should be presented under "new business" and discussed at that time, with the motion possibly being presented at the next meeting. This gives everyone time for research into the subject matter.

RebeccaK1
Posts: 9
Posted:
As Secretary of my HOA, I am strongly in favor of open meetings, if for no other reason than to head off claims of impropriety or secrecy.

On the other hand, there are legitimate reasons for a portion of a board meeting to be private or in closed session, a.k.a. executive session.

One reason that comes to mind is to discuss a legal matter. If an HOA is sued, especially if by a member, it is proper for the board to discuss legal strategy in private.

Another reason is to discuss a strategy for purchasing property. Our HOA is considering purchasing a large vacant parcel adjacent to our beach. The current owner of the vacant parcel is a member. When the board discusses topics like appraisal value, it's appropriate to have those discussions in private.

Whenever a board goes into closed session, the open meeting minutes must indicate the reason for the closed session. In other words, a board can't just hold an executive session and not indicate why.

Our HOA president, on the job for two months, fought as hard as he could to hold closed meetings. The atmosphere became so negative and the board became so divided that I had to ask my personal attorney to send the president a letter to remind him that board meetings must be open (not including the permissible exceptions). The HOA president became so enraged that he resigned a few days ago.

Our HOA was formed under Michigan PA 137, so we are required to comply with the Open Meetings Act and the Freedom of Information Act. Other HOAs might be formed under a different act and might not be required to comply with OMA and FOIA.

As a wise forumer wrote here in a different thread, "If you don't want others to hear what you're saying, you should rethink what you're saying."

Whenever possible, conduct all business out in the open and be as transparent as possible.

My two cents.
GuyF (Michigan)
Posts: 8
Posted:
Our POA was formed in 1970, and is an incorporated non profit. The board members we currently have have made a regular job out of being on the board. They tend to micromanage EVERYTHING. Something else residents have wondered about is the board WILL NOT let anyone know what the agenda is for the upcoming meetings, and many of the residents are questioning this. Most all say that they should publish what the agenda is so that those affected may attend. as it is now decsions are just made, and the residents find out via word of mouth of residents who did attend the meeting. And a BIG BIG Thank you you to everyone who has provided input on my questions !!
GuyF (Michigan)
Posts: 8
Posted:
OH and MUST the board provide minutes of the closed meetings upon request? AND if they refuseto provide them, or say there are none is there a state agency that they can be reported to? Or does it fall upon the residents to start a revolution as it were?
BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By GuyF on 09/10/2011 1:02 PM
Our POA was formed in 1970, and is an incorporated non profit. The board members we currently have have made a regular job out of being on the board. They tend to micromanage EVERYTHING. Something else residents have wondered about is the board WILL NOT let anyone know what the agenda is for the upcoming meetings, and many of the residents are questioning this. Most all say that they should publish what the agenda is so that those affected may attend. as it is now decsions are just made, and the residents find out via word of mouth of residents who did attend the meeting. And a BIG BIG Thank you you to everyone who has provided input on my questions !!

When I first became a member of the Board, I did not get an agenda until the meeting. At least now I get them and 10 or 11 P.M. the day before the Board meeting. At least that is a step in the right direction. (We have a different President) The owners don't know anything about the agenda until the minutes are completed.
CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
In Calif. Open (Regular) Meeting agendas MUST, per Calif. Civil Code, be posted in prominent areas on the premises 4 days (96 hours) in advance of the meeting. these meeting must be open to all HOA members, and members must be permitted to speak Usually before or after the biz portion of the meeting.

In Calif., nothing may be added to the Open Meeting agenda once that 96 hr. period begins, except, of course, emergencies.

In Calif., a majority of directors may NOT meet at the same time & place, including online, to discuss upcoming agenda items. A majority of the board constitutes a "meeting," and such meetings MUST be open to HOA members.

The minutes or "draft" minutes must be ma available to HOA members 30 days after each Open Meeting.

Executive ("closed") Sessions discuss personnel matters, potential litigation, Owner delinquencies, including pre-liens, etc., and conduct hearings with Owners who've allegedly violated the Rules & Regs.

Ex. Sess MAY include the formation of contracts, but our board (I'm pres.) usually does that in Open Meetings. In our HOA of 200+ there always are a couple of rules violations, so we hold Ex. Sess. once a month.

Owners may NOT have access to Ex. Sess. minutes. The topics that are discussed in Ex. Sess. MUST be summarized at the subsequent Open Meeting.

Bonnie, I'm curious about why you directors don't get your agendas until the day before the meeting?? We get ours & all related materials a week ahead. That way, we are able to make decisions about New Business at the meeting. But we have a PM ho puts it all together.
RebeccaK1
Posts: 9
Posted:
I have come to value this forum very much. I've learned a lot, and I've learned that I have a lot more to learn!

When it comes to laws governing HOAs, though, we should keep in mind that different states have different laws, and even within states, the laws that apply to one HOA might be different than the laws that apply to another HOA.

A short time ago I learned that because our HOA was formed under Michigan PA 137, that changes a lot of beliefs I had held about the way we conduct business! Our HOA is required to comply with the Open Meetings Act and with the Freedom of Information Act. Some other HOAs in Michigan are not required to comply with the OMA and FOIA.
EbonyJ (Tennessee)
Posts: 62
Posted:
I have not found anyhting in Tennessee law that says meeting have to be open or anything else related to the laws everyone is speaking of. Does anyone know if Tennessee has similar laws?

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