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KevinL5 (California)
Posts: 3
Posted:
when my parents moved into their condo in 1996, it was brand new and no association was setup, however they did get a copy of CC&R and Bylaw from the builder. it was a three unit complex and no one seems care/know about the HOA law. so they created a joint bank account with three owners' name and deposit certain money each month to cover the common area expense. a few years gone by and they started to realize they haven't had an proper association setup and hence they could never buy liability and fire insurance for the common area. so they asked me to help since none of the owners speak English. i went to my accountant and had him established a none-profitable condo association with all three owners' names as board members. but the accountant office drafted the CC&R and Bylaw for us, i forgot why we didn't use the ones given to us by the builder. so the association was setup and documents were signed and recorded through county. just last week i bought a house and it has its own HOA even though it's a stand alone house, anyways, on the escrow closing day, i received the HOA documents and noticed their CC&R and Bylaw were drafted by an attorney office. does this matter? do i need to tell my parents to recreate their condo's CC&R through a law office? sorry for the long post, thanks.

DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

Kevin,

Lawyers would normally write CC&Rs so that they can be legally binding and will stand up in a court of law. Developers will get CC&Rs written from a boiler plate set that someone has posted on the internet. Any time that my HOA drafts a change in our CC&Rs, we send it to the lawyer to make sure that the language is correct for enforcement.

I am not sure that an accountant is able to draft CC&Rs correctly and in those documents, there are legal items that probably need a lawyers magic touch. Seeing that this group has already been using a set of docs for years, perhaps just a tweeking is nescessary to update what they already have. It would be a good idea because in the futurer when someone needs to sell, a bank or new buyer may not accept the current set.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
You can actually purchase a software/paperwork at many office supply stores that cover various HOA subjects. So there are available "DIY" paperwork packages out there for those courageous enough to undertake the process. However, I would strongly suggest using an attorney specializing in business/corporate/contractual type laws when drafting/modifying your documentation.

The hardest part is getting the actual votes of the membership to make the changes. Ours requires 90% of the membership to agree to change/modify the CC&R's. Which could be done in a special meeting or by proxy vote. As long as the membership knew what those changes were.

We did use an attorney to correct the changes we wanted made. Which were minor such as removing the developer/builder's name, the 2 vote system, and some other technology references etc...You can find out the copy your HOA has on file at the records department at your local courthouse. That way you can make sure the legal filing was done correctly.

In short, you may not need an attorney but it's highly recommended and best solution. A knowledgeable person with experience such as your bookkeeper/MC may have the skills. It's just whatever fits the needs and wants of the HOA.

Former HOA President
JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219
Posted:
Hi Kevin:

You need to go to the County Records and now determine exactly what all is filed and attached to the properties. If the original documents were filed with the County then these potentially were attached and noted possibly on the Warranty Deeds. By filing additional documents you need to make sure there are no issues clouding the titles in having anything duplicated.

Potentially they should have taken the original documents then with proper meeting and votes amended as they wanted. There may not be any issues, but please make sure before someone tries to sell down the road and possibly runs into any issues.

KevinL5 (California)
Posts: 3
Posted:
One of the units already changed ownership couple times. Never had any issue with the documents we currently have. My question was is it by law an hoa's cc&r must be prepared by attorney?
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
The Convenants and Restrictions are filed documents. The by-laws typically are not filed except within the HOA. The articles of incorporation are filed at the state level. They may need addressed as well. If you change 1, it's good to change all. They may all have different levels of majority voting to pass as well. Our CC&R's took 90% while the other documents took 75%. That is something you may want to change.

I'd suggest a good walk through the documentation. You may have POC, technology, rental issues, and other issues that could use an update. It's always best to do this every 5 years anyways.

Former HOA President
DonnaS (Tennessee)
Posts: 5,671
Posted:

NO Kevin, it is not a law that you use an attorney but as everyone has said, it is WISE to use one.
KevinL5 (California)
Posts: 3
Posted:
in my parents condo's case, do the CC&R and Bylaws must be the original ones drafted by the builders? they (owners) couldn't find them when they decided to file for an association many years later, therefore the ones they currently have and on county records are the ones drafted by some accounting firm. does this matter?
JamesC (Maryland)
Posts: 282
Posted:
To the posters responding to this post, and similiar ones for the past few days. The disclaimer to use this forum is below::

This is a positive place for community association leaders to share ideas and learn. This forum is for community association Boards, Committees, Volunteers & HOA Professionals to discuss topics concerning their association duties.
Topics from individual homeowners, who are not acting as association volunteers, are not addressed here & may be removed.

The forum should stick to advice for Association leaders, and board members.

The current post is from a person who is obviously toying with you.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Kevin,

The CC&Rs that would be enforceable would be the last ones filed with your county and attached to the deed.

As for any legality issues caused because a lawyer did or did not draft or review the documents ahead of time, you will need to consult a local attorney and/or challenge the covenants in a court of law.

Tim

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