HOA INFO Sheet illegal?

It's possible that the records the new company got were incomplete and that they are trying to recreate them. Based on that possibility, it also sounds like the Board is relying too much on the management companies and failing to maintain a good membership list etc.

If you do not want to provide the information, I see two options:

1. Provide what information you are willing to provide and leave the other areas blank.

2. Request that they explain why they require the information and cite the governing documents or State law that requires you to provide it.

You have to decide which battles you wish to fight. The battle might be over principal or for something else. You are the one that will have to deal with any repercussions. Therefore, you are the only one who can decide how to approach it.

As a side note: Based on your comment, "My attorney said I am not legally obligated to furnish approvals everytime my HOA board decides to hire a new management company. All questions should be forwarded to my attorney..." , I would strongly recommend that legal action not be implied unless you intend to follow through with it. As any implied or threatened legal action would allow the Association to stop most communication with you except through their attorney and deny access to Association records without a court order (discovery). A better approach might be to just cite the section of the governing documents or State law that applies with the comment "as I understand this section". This way you are informing the board of the law vs. implying possible legal action.

Tim

Marcia:

No, you don't have to submit that information, unless your governing documents specifically state that you have to. What I would do, though, rather than threatening legal action, is trying to find out why this information is needed now, especially if you had submitted such information in the past. If the old management company did not hand over the information and documents to the board or the new management company, then you certainly have a case to bring that up at the next board meeting and asking for an explanation. But I think all of this can be done in a non-confrontational manner.

You gatta love ROGUE BOARDS - and they seem to be more the nor these days. Why is that when people get on a board your community becomes a minnie KINGDOM that they seem to rule over - rather then "concerned and active owners" that were voted onto the board to make sure that things get done right.

As mentioned before - answer the questions you feel would be appropriate: Owners Name, your address, etc. But as far as who else lives there (forget it>>>>) - that is just too much information, as far as I am concerned. Your HOA should have all the other information and should be suppling it to them. But, confirming the owners list is a good thing - and that is as far as the questions should go.

Rogue Boards YES. How dare they request your name and address. But why bother to work with them when you can cite some ridiculous advice from your attorney.

For 30 years now we have requested ownership information similar to what this board is now requesting. But asking for your name that certainly crosses the line.

Maybe as suggested the new MC wants to obtain a new and complete set of owner information. Maybe they wish to serve your property in a more prefessinal and efficient manner. But lets not have any of that.

Recently we had a gas leak in one of our buildings during working hours the fire department needed access to the units or they would get into the units by breaking down the front doors. I was able to call the MC and get phone numbers for those owners and get them to open their units to check for gas. Who would have thought.

How about your car gets hit in the parking lot by lets say a fallen tree don't you want the MC to be able to find out whose car this is? Of course not.

Call your lawyer or at least pretend you have a lawyer.

In 30 years we have requested updates from new and old owners from time to time and not once have we been answered with some legal threat. And this served what purpose?

Gee maybe they have some information they might wish to provide your about your community. Phone numbers if your place is on fire don't call me. If there is some emergency don't bother to e-mail me.

We lost power and hence water a few weeks ago through the use of "e-mail" we were able to keep the owners and residents informed as to what the problem was and where repairs stood. But this ability to comprehend there might be some legitimate reason for your name address and phone number well for some to far fetched to grasp.

Call the lawyer................Must be so nice dealing with such cooperative folks.

Donna:

Lets see your property has hired a new MC to manage YOUR property. They are being paid for this! They have requested some basic information more than likely with the knowledge of the board. Gee what's your name? My lawyer says I don't need to answer that.

Why in God's name would you refuse to provide it?

Because your own personal limitations don't allow you to understand there may be a valid reason to have this information.

As the building burns to the ground. Who lives there? We don't know. How can we contact the owners? We can't. How many people reside in the property? We have no idea.

Why?

Stupidity. What a world....................

Some of you folks are just getting goofy. If you read all the posts, it's not about supplying basic information like the owner's name and contact information. Other information is being requested such as: name, breed of all pets, vehicles make, model, year and license plate, etc. Names, ages, of all people residing in the home. They don't need all of that. As far as the attorney blurbs, it is true that no one is legally obligated to supply architectural approval letters dating back 5 and 6 years ago, everytime the ROGUE board decides to hire a new management company. My board cannot seem to get along with the MCs because they don't follow the rules themselves, and the MCs get fed up with them so they quit, forcing us to hire new MCs. Our turnover from the builder only happened 4 years ago, and we've been through 3 MCs already! It's ridiculous! I do appreciate everyone's input, sarcastic or not.

Here's a thought. This rogue board was elected or put into power how? Then they have the authority to change MCs and that affects you how? Filling out a form? Get reaL Don't you think that causes them more work and effort. If you don't like the job the current board is doing why not seek to win a position on the board and then you could make everything right. Then when YOUR new MC requests people's names they can cooperate just as you have.

With just 4 years under your property's belt my guess the board and the MCs have gone through and will go through a learning curve to work out how things should be done and why. But rather than help them you wish to cmpLicate matters.

I don't come to this site to be goofy. I come to explain what I have seen and learned serving 24 years on the board at my property. And while you can't seem to conceive of any reason the MC should have the vehicle information or information pertaining to your pets I know of many. If you don't wish to hear that then continue on with your method of handling a simple request.

Common sense is just not all that common anymore.

Wow, I am sure I am living in the Midwest. I wasn't aware that the board has police functions also... How about getting to know your neighbors? Granted, we live in a smaller community of about 130 homes, but I think I know everybody living here except for 5 home owners who don't want to have contact with anybody. How? Well, how about talking to people, not just saying hello while passing by, trying to get past those obnoxious neighbors as quickly as possible so that you won't have to talk to them... I know every single dog also, since my dog actually plays with her friends. But I guess instead of talking to people, some prefer to send out forms and then scream bloody murder if they get no responses.

I don't think anybody would be bothered being asked for name and contact information, but why would anyone have to resubmit architectural approval requests for 7 years back just because the board doesn't seem to get their business together?

Peter if I read the OP's posts correctly the property was turned over from the builder just 4 years ago. Then a board took over.

So just how does a board that didn't exist sort of "get its business in order"?

And of course keep records they were never given? Hard if not impossible to do.
Unless the property has a walking around computer system like yourself who knows all the information and will be around 24X7 should it be needed. That really makes sense to you? Sending out a simple form works for me.

Maybe, and here's a wild idea the builder didn't provide complete records and maybe the new MC is trying to re-build the records for the property to the best of their ability. But hell why would you wish to assist in that sort of effort?

And just what are "policing functions"? Another misunderstood term to be used to support a position that cannot be rationalized.

Not hard to guess why the property has gone through 4 MCs tough to work with people who consult their lawyer when asked for their name.

The board is elected to manage the property. An MC is hired to help the board perform their jobs. The residents do nothing to assist the MC's efforts or the board's efforts. Sounds like a good plan to me.

Peter,

Doing a search on the site for Illinois HOA posts, I came up with 577 of them which tells me that not everyone in Illinois HOA's talk to each other. I am originally from Wisconsin (348 posts) so being a Midwesterner does not make us better talkers.

Peter you missed my point no real sense taking the time to explain it to you. My snese it would take some time.

Yes you and the OP have the opinion the board has no right to request anything. I got it. With all that "policing function" you spoke about.

And yes here in NY we don't speak to anyone, especially my neighbors. Is that really the way YOU see the world? And why would the MC go door to door when they can send out a form? Is that the way you do things out west? Must take some time getting things done. Only in the Midwest does that happen. Really tough to get anywhere with someone who seems to have it all figured out.

You're right hope that makes you feel better.

Jennifer - very well stated. Every situation is different. I don't live in a Condo association, we have single family homes. There is no posting wall with information about MC, or who the board is. We do have a website and also a printed community directory. In case of an emergency, if police, fire fighters, or any other people from outside the community show up, I think it is very unlikely they would know who our MC is or who the board members are, instead they would ask residents who come out of their homes, as has happened several times over the past few years. In that case, the residents helped out by notifying owners or contacting anybody who needed to be contacted. Having the information submitted to MC wouldn't have helped anything, as their offices are 10 miles away... I am not opposed to giving emergency contact information, but the best way in my community is my direct neighbors - they know who lives in my house, know my pet, I tell them when I am away so that they can check mail and papers, and they also have a key to my house in case of emergency etc. And I return the favor - since we are all doing that, the community is a nice place to live - but it isn't because we had given all our information to the MC, who may or may not be around 2 or 3 years from now, and then have to resubmit it, since the board again lost the information and just 'tries to make the neighborhood a better place to live'... If new neighbors move in, we invite them to our house, as has happened to us when we moved in. Get to know them, don't just send a form...

What I want to say is that a neighborhood is just as good as the neighbors. It can be great, or it can be real bad to live in. In my experience, having lived in several different HOAs in different parts of the country, having an HOA didn't help one way or the other. It's always the people in the neighborhood who make or brake it.

There also is no need to 'police' other residents. I've learned over the years that HOAs with obsessive boards who want to control everything really make bad neighborhoods to live in - people who thrive on conflict and really want to be in other people's business. Fortunately I am in a community now where lots of people contribute, and where the board does not send out ridiculous requests as to resubmit all past architectural improvement requests - makes me wonder what else they would have lost 'in transition' from one MC to the other or from the builder at turnover.

Marcia - I hope you got answers, and are able to ignore the negative, attacking, and insulting comments that some feel they need to make. If I were you, I would ask why those past architectural requests are needed, and what else may have been lost in the past - you may have a bigger issue in your HOA than just being asked to resubmitting those.

From reading all the responses on this subject, I can see both sides, but I have to lean in favor of providing the information. The letter from the attorney was overkill (you could have just asked the management company why the information was needed and if they didn't know or wouldn't answer, go to a board meeting and ask them.)

I suspect the architectural change information identify who obtained approval for exterior changes vs. those who didn't. Sometimes people will say "why do I have to change such and such - it was like that when I got here!" Getting the ACR information would help verify that, especially since most communities (like mine) state that maintenance of approved exterior changes are the responsibility of the owner who put it in and everyone who owns the house after it's sold or transferred. A lot of people don't know this (or know to ask about it) when they buy a home in a HOA community and I'm sure the paperwork isn't among the ton of other stuff you get at closing.

Regarding the board's not getting approval to change the declarations is a different issue - if homeowners had questions or concerns about that, they should have brought up the issue before now.

Don't they already have the name/address since they sent the notice to a name/address?

Donna, it seems like you've expanded the purpose of the HOA. It isn't to babysit someone who doesn't want to provide the info. Robberies? Let the police deal with it. IF a neighbour sees suspicious activity they most likely already know their neighbours vehicle. I doubt that neighbour is going to call the HOA/mgmt company to report a suspicious vehicle and the HOA is going to respond on the spot!

If the HOA could care less about saving the property if the HO isn't willing to provide the info then there was no need for the statement "They also threatened that if we did not send the info sheet back filled out completely, we "could" be fined for "non-compliance." "

This sounds more like a move towards enforcement issues than anything else.

Again, thank you everyone for your responses. I guess it would have mattered if I had told you that my 16 year old daughter and I are being stalked by one of our neighbors, and that particular neighbor was arrested for assaulting me back in 2006. I did mention that we have gone through 3 management companies and the only board member I respected, quit the board and sold his home to get out of this hemorroid on the anus of town because the job transfer he put in for came through. His employer purchased his home from him, otherwise he would have never sold. He was the only one who put the time, care, effort and money into his home similar to mine. God bless him and his family. There a very few people I care to associate with here, because they have turned into white trash. We made a huge mistake purchasing in a neighborhood originally sold as an UPPER middle class neighborhood, but when the economy starting going south, our builder bargain-basemented the prices of these 3200 - 4000 square feet homes. Now I'm stuck with an absolutely gorgeous one acre lot, with in ground pool, firepit with surround seating, small orchard, inside I have 2000 square feet of brazilian cherry on my first floor, Juperana Bordeaux granite on just about every surface including the fireplace hearth, surround and mantle, along with a REAL gourmet kitchen including highend appliances, living next store to people who cannot afford to paint their exteriors, people who don't tend to the landscaping, people who don't have enough money to get professional landscaping so it looks like crap, people who leave their garbage cans out at the curb for days after pick-up, among lots of other things. I hate it here, and our board members are guilty of everything I mentioned. We are educated, hard working people who take extreme pride in our investment and it is not nice living amongst people who are not proud of what they have, or who simply shouldn't have purchased here in the first place. My board did a lousy job of protecting me from that stalker who eventually assaulted me in our community clubhouse, after I complained about him following me for months. I also took him to civil court where he confessed to stalking us and sending us anonymous emails telling me he stalks us!

They receive my payment on time, never late, so they know who lives here. The HOA has first right of refusal when someone sells, so they are the first to know the new buyer's name and address. When a property goes into foreclosure, they get served with lis pendens, so they know what's going on before anyone else. I feel if I wanted to share anything else, I would. They do not deserve my respect, as they do not show it to me by pristine maintanance of their properties. My board members are rule violating slobs who are too ignorant to know they are slobs.

I have lived in HOAs all my adult life, and this is the first one I ever have had issue with due to their lack of concern for others. Whatever they do is self serving and nosey. I digress.

Does that help everyone understand my position a little better?

MarciaD, I don't see how or why the HOA would protect you from a stalker? Why was it their responsibility? Seems that is a POLICE issue and the law should have been involved. Hence, why you had to take the matter to court. Blaming the HOA isn't the solution. Home is where we make it. Depending on others to protect us or think like we do isn't possible. You want a better HOA, you make it one. Simply put...

On a personal note, I do understand about your stalking issue. It has happened to me not just once...There is frustration and it seems no one believes you. Some will make excuses like "He likes you"..."I don't see a problem"...or "You wish" etc...There are really poor laws out there when it comes to stalking and enforcement of it. It is NOT a HOA responsibility even if he lives next door. You need to work on helping write new laws for your state/locality that addresses this issue instead. There are other victims/survivors out there that need to stick together and work on improving the system from this happening over and over again. Get help and understand what to do to protect yourself. I was able to escape from my stalker and take my lessons learned to educate other women about the warning signs...