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BobW1 (Florida)
Posts: 11
Posted:
I live in a gated townhome hoa. With one main street that is a private street with units on both sides.
A resident has a camera in an upstairs bedroom that faces the street. The blinds are shut except for the necessary room to stick the camera lens thru the blinds. It is not pointed down at the street or up in the sky, it is pointed at the units across the street.
There are several single women with children living across the street.
I am not on the bod and have not notified the bod. I have notified the mc. The mc suggests we "observe" the situation. The resident who told me about this camera says it's been up for at least 6 months. My feeling is that the issue needs to be addressed now.
The reason I have not notified the bod is whatever action is taken needs to be lawful and professional. This could be a completely innocent situation or a serious unlawful situation. If the bod or a single bod addresses this resident the bod could get involved in a very sticky legal issue and liability problems.
If something were to happen I would feel personally responsible. Please offer some advise.
CharlesW1 (Georgia)
Posts: 826
Posted:
BobW1,

Not having the knowledge many of the others on this discussion forum have to give, I would suggest calling the local police. I don’t think this is an HOA problem, but it is something that needs to be addressed ASAP.

Chuck W.

Charles E. Wafer Jr.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
At the very least you should talk to the people being watched, don't assume they know. Let them go to the police; peeping activity can escalate. There could be an un-registered sex offender in your midst. This is not something that the MC should "watch". If something happens and it can be proven that the MC and the BOD had knowledge and didn't act, it could cost big$$$. If you reported it to the MC, they should report it to the BOD.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Bob, if I was the managing agent I would have told you I would check it out. Then I would contact the person with the aledged camera to find out what they have to say; let them know I expect them to act appropriately; and that I would be monitoring the situation.
BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640
Posted:
Bob:

I don't feel this is an HOA issue. I wouuld suggest contacting the people whose homes are being watched and let them know and make their own determination what to do. You could even go so far to alert the local police that you think something suspicious is going on. When it comes to things that are criminal in nature I think it is best to let the appropriate authorities contact the person in question. My 2 cents.
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
unless you have a covenant about cameras in your CC&R's, what is the board's position? the board enforces the HOA rules, not the state's.

let the state deal with this. inform the camera owner, if you must, or the people you suspect are being spied upon, and let them deal with it. For all you know, it could be a totally legal business, run over the web. Who knows what consenting adults agree to anymore?

HaroldS (Arizona)
Posts: 906
Posted:
I agree, policing alleged peeping toms is not an HOA function unless the documents define it. With all the other duties a board has, I wouldn't think they would want to get involved in something like this, much less the MC.
But then, I've been told here before that it is the duty of the board to meddle. Harold
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
I disagree that it is not an HOA concern, since it is a gated community; the people living there have the expectation of a certain amount of safety and security. It is not their business to go the person with the camera but at the very least the proper authorities should be contacted & the people being spied on notified. My concern is the MC making the decision to "observe" the situation. Since they have been notified that a problem exists at the very least it is their responsibility to bring it to the BOD's attention.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
WilliamT (Arizona)
Posts: 489
Posted:
I don't believe the BOD has any authority over someone placing a camera in their own window. No one can be certain where the camera is pointing, or what photos, if any, are being taken, or for what purpose. As of now it is pure speculation.

Just as it is not against the law to place a camera on the outside of your property for covert surveilance purposes, I doubt that it is against the law to place a camera in your own window for overt or covert surveilance. Obviously the camera is not covert because people see it from the outside.

If I were on that board, my position would be that the BOD has no authority written in the Bylaws or CC&R's to question someone with a camera in their window, therefore, the board cannot get involved. To get involved by going to question that owner could be viewed as an invasion of privacy.

Unless the board has authority to question an owner about a camera in their window, then the MC, who represents the Association, would have no authority to question this owner.

If neighbors are concerned, then they should contact the police and let the authorities investigate. If the police arrest the person for doing something illegal and it is proven in court, then the BOD may take action against the owner if the CC&R's state that no one shall perform any illegal activities in their homes or in the community.

There are conflicting opinions on this subject. My suggestion for the BOD is to follow the guidance of the Bylaws and CC&R's.
BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640
Posted:
I think it is admirable that BOD's want to protect the people in their communities. But I think you have to remember what the BOD's responsibilities are, to enforce the CC&r's, Maintain common areas, maintain a nice neighborhood, etc. I think getting involved in a potential criminal matter is not a good decision.

Let's say this person is recording some people at intimate moments, is confronted by the BOD, and decides to destroy any and all evidence. There is no crime in pointing a camera out of your home, but if he is recording people for some other purpose without their knowledge then yes it is. Now the BOD has ruined a chance to catch someone who is going to find a way to victimize other people. But...if you alert the neighbor, let them make a decision whether to call it in, then the police have an opportunity to surveil, get a warrant and seize evidence.
BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640
Posted:
Brian is right, plus there is a difference between an outside security camera for your home and what this situation is. Typically outside security cameras have limited range and sight lines unless you are willing to spend thousands of dollars.

It isn't event limited to Federal buildings, I have seen cases where people have gotten questioned and police reports written for them simply taking pictures/video of stadiums and arenas.
KennyD1 (Texas)
Posts: 51
Posted:
As a president of my HOA and employee for the State of Texas Criminal Justice, you have every right to ask and question the homeowner of the resident and ask what they are recording. If they say it for security reason, and you feel that the way there camera is pointing is not set for that reason, then inform your local police department. The police will view the material recorded to make sure that this person is not recording anything illegal. The the police make the call. Do not confront the resident about this, cause you can cause the person to get unstable and remove any evidence if the police does get involed.
ChadK (North Carolina)
Posts: 43
Posted:
OK the patriot act. Well I don't think a private residence is a national security interest (unless it is the white house).

The guy is probably a wierd guy pointing his camera out the window. But other than range and quality. Really what is the difference in a security camera pointed from the side of a building or thru the window? Maybe this guy wants security on a tight budjet?

I gaurantee if you tell the police that he is pointing a camera out of his window they will tell you that he is breaking no laws. The paparatci point cameras at movie stars all the time. Sometimes it causes problems (fights..etc) but it is legal. I am intrigued about this subject. If you talk to your local police, please post your findings.
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
yup Chad, just about everything the government wants to make illegal is now illegal under the patriot act, down to what you do in your own home, if they desire.

that's what you get when 500 elected legistators vote "YES" on a bill that EVERY ONE OF THEM ADMITS THEY NEVER BOTHERED TO READ!

BradP (Kansas)
Posts: 2,640
Posted:
The bottom line is intent...what is the intention of the person with the camera? Where is the camera pointed, what is the intent, what footage is there and what is it being used for. The person with the camera in the window could have a legit reason for it being there, but those are questions they need to answer.
RonaldW (South Carolina)
Posts: 901
Posted:
........ If something were to happen I would feel personally responsible. Please offer some advise.


OK, Tell the people who you believe are being watched about the camera. Suggest that they contact to local police. It's not the HOA's business and it's arguably not yours.

Ron
SC
RonaldW (South Carolina)
Posts: 901
Posted:
Posted By RonaldW on 12/17/2006 10:05 AM

........ If something were to happen I would feel personally responsible. Please offer some advise.


OK, Tell the people who you believe are being watched about the camera. Suggest that they contact to local police. It's not the HOA's business and it's arguably not yours.


That should read "contact the local police."


Ron
SC

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