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RichardL7 (Colorado)
Posts: 105
Posted:
Referencing The laws of Colorado ( HS Bill 05-100 + update’s of 2005/06) that relates to the Condominium complex, not one word has ever been mentioned or received from the management company, or the board on this subject.

My question is, just who is responsible for acquiring the information and informing the members of the association. No mention of it has ever been address to us or to the owners I have spoken with. I’m not sure just what the responsibilities of the board or Management company are. Can you help?
Sincerely:
Richard.
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
A Management company works from the directions given by the Board.

The board should instruct the management company to disseminate any info it needs to get to its members.
JonD1
Posts: 2,350
Posted:
Richard:

Just to be sure I understand your question. You would like to know who should be providing the property owners with all the state laws and standards to make them aware of the latest government rulings on condo properties. If that is your question my answer would be the property owners should take the time to find that information for themselvesmot rely on the Board or MC compnay to provide them with such details.

I would doubt not many if any at all documents ever suggest the Board is required to provide legal updates to the property owners in the event some state law is enacted or updated.

IMO as property owners that would and ashould fall to the property owners to make themselves aware.
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
RichardL, it is difficult for me to believe that your management company would not have advised the Board of the required Policies and Procedures (Rules and Regulations)under CCIOA (Colorado Common Interest Ownership Act). SB05-100 became part of CCIOA over 5 years ago! Even if your association is not under CCIOA (pre 1992, etc.) you still need established policies and procedures (P&P) including handling of delinquent accounts and Covenant violations. And these P&P need to be distributed to all owners by the Board.

So who is responsible? Any competent management company would accept the responsibility of providing CCIOA information to the Board, whether their management agreement states this or not. The Board is responsible for hiring a competent management company that is willing to provide ongoing updates to the Board on legislation. The Board is ultimately responsible for distributing information to the owners and for having a knowledgable agent who will suggest what information must be provided to the owners.
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
You haven't told us WHAT specific information is being talked about.

Are you asking if the MC should be the knowledgeable consultant of all HOA statutes and advise the Board --- or --- if the board should be aware of all those state laws?
JonD1
Posts: 2,350
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RichardL7 on 04/07/2011 7:45 AM
Referencing The laws of Colorado ( HS Bill 05-100 + update’s of 2005/06) that relates to the Condominium complex, not one word has ever been mentioned or received from the management company, or the board on this subject.

My question is, just who is responsible for acquiring the information and informing the members of the association. No mention of it has ever been address to us or to the owners I have spoken with. I’m not sure just what the responsibilities of the board or Management company are. Can you help?
Sincerely:
Richard.

"My question is, just who is responsible for acquiring the information and informing the members of the association."

The OP seems to suggest someone should pull together this sort of information and hand it over to the property owners for their use and knowledge.

I don't think the Board or the MC has any obligation to collect and provide that sort of information. The property owners have some role in operation of their property not everything is left up to the Board.
JeanneK3 (Maryland)
Posts: 562
Posted:
RichardL:
Shouldn't the responsibility for providing homeowners easy to understand interpretations of state law be with the state? If you try to look up Fair Housing Laws at the federal level you don't get directed to a mountain of legislation; rather you see summaries of the legislation first. Maryland doesn't have any such summary; maybe other states do. I'd be interested in knowing of any states that do this.
Jeanne
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JeanneK3 on 04/07/2011 12:28 PM
RichardL:
Shouldn't the responsibility for providing homeowners easy to understand interpretations of state law be with the state?

I would have to say that this responsibility would be with your attorney.

I think it's great when summaries of laws are provided in an easy to read format. If States can afford that option, great. However, what happens if the summary is incorrect - who would be at fault?

Tim
JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219
Posted:
Hi Richard:

No one in essence provides unless sometimes required by law … it is called due diligence. Individuals are responsible for knowing certain laws themselves as they are posted and available for everyone to research and read. There are numerous criminal, fraud, etc. laws and if someone breaks said law they in essence cannot say “I did not know” and not be charged with a crime. The law would still apply whether they potentially knew or not.

Be careful when referencing House Bills or Senate Bills. Just because they have been proposed before the House or Senate, does not mean they have passed and been made into law. There was a poster a while back who referenced a law and I finally was able to find out that they actually were referencing a bill and which had NOT been passed and was not an actual law for their state.

I believe you brought this subject up in another link:
http://www.hoatalk.com/Forum/tabid/55/forumid/1/postid/109521/view/topic/Default.aspx

Also, the bill as Roger stated you are referencing has been made into law and potentially the following is the info regarding your question:

38-33.3-209.7. Owner education.

(1) The association shall provide, or cause to be provided, education to owners at no cost on at least an annual basis as to the general operations of the association and the rights and responsibilities of owners, the association, and its executive board under Colorado law. The criteria for compliance with this section shall be determined by the executive board.

(2) Notwithstanding section 38-33.3-117 (1.5) (c), this section shall not apply to an association that includes time-share units, as defined in section 38-33-110 (7).

If you really want to know the various responsibilities then you need to thoroughly read your HOA governing documents and the state statutes. We do not know what your governing documents state; therefore, regarding many items you need to read and research.

As Susan stated the overall HOA responsibility is the HOA Board. The board hired the Management Company and said company answers to your board of directors.

Colorado also has a new HOA Information Office and Resource Center.

Here is the website address:
http://www.dora.state.co.us/Real-estate/licensing/subdivisions/HOA.htm

There are links at the bottom for both the CCIOA Statutes and Non-Profit Corporation Statutes. These are the items you read … please do not rely on house or senate bills and think they are actual laws.

FredS7 (Arizona)
Posts: 927
Posted:
"The association shall provide, or cause to be provided, education to owners at no cost on at least an annual basis as to the general operations of the association and the rights and responsibilities of owners, the association, and its executive board under Colorado law. The criteria for compliance with this section shall be determined by the executive board. "

Seems to me this would be satisfied by making a yearly mailing "Re-read your association documents. Now."
RichardL7 (Colorado)
Posts: 105
Posted:
My dear friends.
First and foremost I want to thank all of you for your support and comments, and trust me when I say they have been most helpful and informative. As we can see the information given is most extensive and helpful. And as one said at one time, ignorance of the law is no excuse, and yet some consideration must be given to the following.

Now, considering the amount of information at hand that’s related to the association’s, how would one come to fine that information if not informed of it’s existence? as I was and from a different Management Co.
How is a layman to understand that information? Also at this time I should think some one would need to be responsible for obtaining the documentation and then informing the home owners.

One would need to know of it’s existence some way or somehow. That in it’s self would lead me to believe that the management company would be the first to address the situation and then report it to the board and at that time the board would instruct the management company to inform the home owners, or at least I would think so at this time.

My friends, I’m not trying to be difficult, but not all have computer and as working people (home owners) they need to trust someone to give instructions or advise somehow. The information given to me at this time and in the past has been most helpful, and yet I’m learning the best I can and to assist the association, I just don’t think the working homeowners have the time, and need to trust the board and the management company. I just trust I’m not missing the boat on the subject. :-)

As for myself I had no idea of the amount of information related to the association (not the home owners laws I’m OK on that ) let alone start to understand it. As I conclude, I need to say one thing more on the subject, I have received more help and assistance from the people who have assisted me then I ever have from the Management company or the Board. That is a fact. My hat is off to all of you.
Sincerely:
Richard. PS, and yes I feel like I'm back in school on this. :-)
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RichardL7 on 04/08/2011 7:50 PM

How is a layman to understand that information? Also at this time I should think some one would need to be responsible for obtaining the documentation and then informing the home owners.

One would need to know of it’s existence some way or somehow. That in it’s self would lead me to believe that the management company would be the first to address the situation and then report it to the board and at that time the board would instruct the management company to inform the home owners, or at least I would think so at this time.

Richard,

I believe everyone of us started out not knowing where to look or really understand what we were looking at.

As you know, there are many, many, many, laws that the average person is not aware of until it directly impacts them. This isn't to say the actual law isn't available for the individual to look up and read. It's just the practicality that most individuals have better things to do with their lives until an issue comes up that affects the individual or the individuals family directly enough for them to find the time to research and try to understand the laws surrounding that issue.

Most States have enacted disclosure laws so that most of the information available surrounding an Association is provided to a potential buyer at the time of purchase. However, laws and governing documents change and it's once again left up to the individual to become interested enough to make the time and do some research. The material is usually available if someone takes the time to look. Fortunately, the internet has made the process easier.

The place everyone should start would be the governing documents. All of the governing documents. This would include:

The Declaration of Covenants Conditions and Restrictions
The Articles of Incorporation
The Bylaws
Policy Resolutions (adopted by the Board)
Administrative Resolutions (adopted by the Board).

Then work look at your State laws:

Property Laws
Corporate Laws (if Association is incorporated)
Contract Laws (as this is what your CC&Rs are)
Energy Laws (as they might effect solar panels, generators, etc.)
environmental laws

Don't forget County or City codes:

Local towing ordinances (if your Association has the right to tow)
Building codes

Then there are Federal Laws and Regulations:

HUD/FHA guidelines (as the Association now has to provide info)
Fair Housing Laws
IRS Codes
American Disabilities Act
Fair Debt Collection Practices Act
Solders Sailors Civil Relief Act
FCC Over The Air Reception Devices (satellite dish law)

Oh, lets not forget various case laws or court opinions that may or may not affect the interpretation of any of the above laws.

Additionally, I am positive that there are many, many more I have forgotten. As you stated, it would be great if Board members took the time to get this information out to the membership. However, you need to remember that Board members are usually just volunteers who, like most of us, have better things to do with their lives. Therefore, it leaves the responsibility to the individual. I would offer the following advise to any individual:

Trust, but verify!

If someone is willing to offer advise or an interpretation, I would recommend that you never take that information on face value. You should always verify, to the best of your ability, what that person is telling you with your own research and, ideally, reading the law yourself. Granted, the individual probably wouldn't intentionally mislead you. However, they are only providing their interpretation of what they read or were told.

Personally, I provide advise based on information contained in the question and my interpretation of the question. I base the advise on my own personal experiences, any research and understanding coupled, hopefully, with some common sense. If the information provided changes or a new document is located or my experience in dealing with a similar issue changes, that advise could easily change.

In a recent discussion on HOAtalk we even discussed how to interpret laws (click the link to go to that thread).

I believe you summed the whole issue up when you stated, I feel like I'm back in school on this. This is how I feel and I believe everyone on this forum feels.

Tim

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Oops:

Then work look at your State laws

should have read

Then would look at your State laws

RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
RichardL7, you have possed the essence and provided the answer to your original question with your statement:

"One would need to know of it’s existence some way or somehow. That in it’s self would lead me to believe that the management company would be the first to address the situation and then report it to the board and at that time the board would instruct the management company to inform the home owners, or at least I would think so at this time."

That is exactly how it works. Competant managers attend classes to receive training and to be updated on changes in state statues and court cases. Good managers provide information to each Board as applicable. Ultimately it is the Board's responsibility, acting on behalf of the Association, to make sure required information plus other desired information is provided to the homeowners.

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219
Posted:
Hi Richard:

What it boils down to ultimately in CO it is the executive board who is supposed to give education to owners on an annual basis. Some may rely on their MC as Roger stated; however, that would depend on whether or not the MC is as competent company as the one in which Roger works for when representing HOA’s and which is a sponsor for this website. They are also located in CO in case your HOA is interested in possibly a different MC company (as you can note he gives pretty sound advice).

LOL … how is a layman to understand. Most do not as everything is written in legal language by lawyers for in essence lawyers. That is why you see all the questions posted on this website. Some of us understand because even though we may not be attorneys we have worked in the legal field to some extent. Others understand because they have dealt with various legal issues pertaining to their various state statutes and HOA’s. We are all from various backgrounds and various situations, but are here to try and help others as best we can, based on our experiences and knowledge.

Tim pretty much hit the nail on the head with how all of us have acquired the bulk of our knowledge. Also I totally agree with his assessment of everyone on this forum feels like they are back in school. There are always changes to governing documents within an HOA along with State Statutes. Therefore, we are all always learning and trying to insure we keep updated on all new information. Guess you could say we are always in essence back in school.

RichardL7 (Colorado)
Posts: 105
Posted:
Tonight is the Board meeting, and with all the assistance given it will be a big help me. As always discretion and understanding will be part of the tools used by me. Just want to help rebuild the HOA to it’s former self and to the status as when first started. I think it can be done as long as we support each other and work together.
Thank you one and all.
Richard.

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