Shutting Off Water

I have searched the forum but couldn't find an answer to this specific question. All the other topics dealt with homeowners not paying their assessment and the Association trying to turn the water off.

We have two Associations that share the water bill from the local utility company. The same utility company bills the homeowner for electricity and garbage separately. We utilize a national utility billing service to bill the homeowners for the water they use. They collect from the homeowners and deposit the funds into our account.

If the homeowner doesn't pay their water bill, do you think the HOA would or should have the power to shut the water off, just as the utility company would. If we don't pay the other Association, the Cost Sharing Agreement between the two entities allows for them to turn the water off to our entire Association.

Abso-freakin-lutely they should have the power to shut off the water to non-payers just like a utility company can but unfortunately I believe that Virginia is the only state it is legal to do so. In Ohio we can do it for commercial condos but not residential. I mean we wouldn't want to cause the non-payers any hardship or inconvenience, it might damage their self esteem. There would however have to be some method for people who are ill or disable to keep the water on just like a utility must. See I'm not totally heartless like some have intimated.

i like to point out that it is perfectly legal to shut off the water for emergency repairs.

we used to have emergency repairs at the worst imaginable times for some of our deadbeat owners, right when they were showering for work, etc..

Jeanne,

so, if the city/county shuts off the water to a home for non-payment, does the health dept issue them a citation?

Our board puts a 8 x 10" brightly colored shut-off notice on the front door of the home. After that, someone will come out and spraypaint the area of the property where the shut-off valve is and where the digging will be commenced.

About 99% of the past due accounts get some action on them, at that point.

Jim,

Why not negotiate with the water company to put meters in for each lot. Even if the Association picks up some of the cost, it will save money in the long run.

Tim

Thanks for all the good advise.

I don't know what kind of problem we have until I have access to the billing service's online system. Water is from the City of Los Angeles and they have a written policy for non-payment of bills which we will follow, again not shutting off to elderly or disabled.

Our meters were not put in by LADWP, but by the builder, so we or the manager of the water system has to read the meters and then bill the homeowners. Even though the billing collects from the homeowners, the Association is liable for the bill whether people pay or not.

We just formed a Water Committee to deal with this issue, as well as trying to conserve water for the Association common area and helping resident conserve as well. They will also help in re-writing the Cost Sharing Agreement with the other Association. Our health department is with the county and hell wil freeze over long before they would show up.

You would need to see how much savings the Association would have by not paying the water bill for everyone, including the potential ability to better cover delinquent accounts. I suspect that the Association would save money over the long term. How long it would take to break even you would have to figure out.

Question, did anyone actually contact the utilities to see what the cost would be or was it just discussed as an option without getting hard numbers?

Not sure why the state doesn' show up. I'm from California

Richard,

Since you are in California, this snippet from Davis-Sterling may help (although I have my doubts, see below):

QUESTION: Is it possible to partially turn off water for delinquent owners? For instance, can the association install turn-off valves for the unit so the deadbeat owner has some water but making it difficult for him to either bathe or do his dishes?

ANSWER: California's Supreme Court has determined that associations are "for all practical purposes" a landlord. (Francis T v. Village Green.) Under landlord-tenant law, landlords may not willfully cause, "directly or indirectly," the interruption or termination of utility service to a tenant's residence with the intent to terminate occupancy. Utilities covered include, but are not limited to, water, heat, light, electricity, telephone, gas, elevators and refrigeration. (Civ. Code §789.3.) Cable TV does not qualify as a utility.

Read more: Turning Off Utilities http://www.davis-stirling.com/MainIndex/TurningOffWater/tabid/2610/Default.aspx#ixzz3J0FgjTMi
from Davis-Stirling.com by Adams Kessler PLC. If your association needs legal assistance, call us at (800) 464-2817.

As is often the case, Adams Kessler has over-reached with at least part of this analysis. The issue before the court in Francis T was security in a condominium complex and the court held that the condo association had the same duty to protect its residents and guests as a landlord in an apartment complex. I cannot imagine any circumstance where the court would hold that an HOA in a community of detached single-family homes is "a landlord."

It is also less than certain that a condo association is deemed to be a landlord in all circumstances. Even less certain is whether residential landlord-tenant statutes would apply to a condo association. If you follow Adams Kessler's logic to its conclusion, the association would have the right to evict an owner for non-payment of his water bill.

If was running the show, I would arrange for emergency water shutoffs at all the deadbeats' units.

Larry

I agree with you 200%.

As noted above some states preclude such self-help remedies by HOAs :

Florida : Sun Sentinel Nov 6 2014 attorney Lindsay Raphael : http://blogs.sun-sentinel.com/condoblog/2014/11/question-can-a-condominium-association-turn-off-your-water-if-you-don%E2%80%99t-pay-your-assessments.html

"Question: Can a condominium association turn off your water if you don’t pay your assessments ?"

of course, unless California is bound by Florida state law.

As to your second invited issue if state law allows such : "If the homeowner doesn't pay their water bill, do you think the HOA would or SHOULD have the power to shut the water off ? "

Where defaulters of all sorts of utilities are not directly metered customers of an arms-length utility company, not much defence for the unfairness of someone getting a free ride (while complying consumers struggle).

But self-help remedies frighten me almost as much, including the inaccuracy/accuracy of billing calculations whether from utility companies themselves or from skillset challenged middlemen. Our jurisdiction privatized an efficient, credible (but grotesquely taxpayer subsidized) electric power supply environment years; now it sends out thousands of bills sometimes months late for often wildly inaccurate consumptions in bizarre lingo- think "Here's your bill for $1 million this month . . "). Even getting a bill is sometimes tough.

Lawful collections & liens should be lawfully & even-handedly pursued as early as legally possible.