ccr changes question

JackJ4 (Michigan)
Posts: 2

Posted:

I apologize if this has already been answered but I am new to this and need help.

Our HOA feels present covenants are "simply out of date" and in 2009 tried to change them but members voted no. Now in 2010 they are trying again. It appears the only people that want change is the BOD. I have a few questions.

1. Is there any restrictions on how much or how often they can be re introduced and voted on. Can the BOD refuse to let members address these proposed ammendments at meetings, or deny members to ask questions.

2. Can the Board present "highlight summaries of proposed Covenant revisions on a door to door basis, as well as asking for a vote at that time", Can they change the way we vote, time we vote and gather votes door to door, and how do we know vote is valid?

3. We live on a canal and some residents have covered boat wells, boat houses etc., can they add updates or restrictions to deny homeowners from building new ones, maintaining old ones, and force the removal of existing structures based on the boards decision to do so. Do owners have any rights that would grandfather these structures or any state or government laws (DNR) that would override the HOA boards desicions.

Members are not happy that our concerns are not being addressed, and that were not given any opportunity to ask questions at the last Annual Membership Meeting. What can we do? We do not want these covenants adopted until we can address this board and members as a group. It appears they are relentless to change them even after the majority that attends the meetings have voted.
Any suggestions or places to conduct research, or how to inform neighbors would be appreciated. I am wondering if members can create facebook or twitter accounts to encourage members to discuss the "highlight summaries of proposed Covenant revisions" since we can not discuss it at meetings with our board. Thank you.

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202

Posted:

THE BOARD MUST FOLLOW THE BYLAWS OR CCRS FOR THE PROCEDURE FOR AMENDING THEM.

1. Is there any restrictions on how much or how often they can be re introduced and voted on. Can the BOD refuse to let members address these proposed ammendments at meetings, or deny members to ask questions. NO, BUT YU NEED TO ASK FOR A MOTION FOR THE BOARD TO SET ANOTHER MEETING FOR THE SOLE PURPOSE OF DISCUSSING THESE PROPOSED AMENDMENTS. ASK FOR AN INFORMATION GATHERING, A TOWN MEETING OR COMMITTEE MEETING.

2. Can the Board present "highlight summaries of proposed Covenant revisions on a door to door basis, as well as asking for a vote at that time", Can they change the way we vote, time we vote and gather votes door to door, and how do we know vote is valid? YES, THEY CAN VISIT HOMEOWNERS AND TRY TO CONVINCE THEM ON A ONE TO ONE BASIS. THAT'S CALLED CAMPAIGNING. BUT THEY CAN NOT GATHER THE OFFICIAL VOTE AT THAT TIME. THE VOTE WILL HAVE TO COME AT A DULY CALLED MEETING OR HOW IT IS STATED IN YOUR DOCUMENTS.

3. We live on a canal and some residents have covered boat wells, boat houses etc., can they add updates or restrictions to deny homeowners from building new ones, maintaining old ones, and force the removal of existing structures based on the boards decision to do so. Do owners have any rights that would grandfather these structures or any state or government laws (DNR) that would override the HOA boards desicions. I ALWAYS UNDERSTOOD THAT THE DNR HAS JURISDICTION OVER SURFACE WATER, SO THE HOA HAS POWER ONLY ON PROPERTY THAT IT OWNS OR IS COVERED IN THE CCRS. IF STRUCTURES ARE BEING BUILT THAT ARE PROHIBITED IN THE CCRS, THEN THEY COULD ASK FOR THEIR REMOVAL. GRANDFATHERING GETS COMPLICATED, SINCE IT'S A KIND OF "EVERYONE BUT ME" MENTALITY.

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202

Posted:

THE BOARD MUST FOLLOW THE BYLAWS OR CCRS FOR THE PROCEDURE FOR AMENDING THEM.

1. Is there any restrictions on how much or how often they can be re introduced and voted on. Can the BOD refuse to let members address these proposed ammendments at meetings, or deny members to ask questions. NO, BUT YU NEED TO ASK FOR A MOTION FOR THE BOARD TO SET ANOTHER MEETING FOR THE SOLE PURPOSE OF DISCUSSING THESE PROPOSED AMENDMENTS. ASK FOR AN INFORMATION GATHERING, A TOWN MEETING OR COMMITTEE MEETING.

2. Can the Board present "highlight summaries of proposed Covenant revisions on a door to door basis, as well as asking for a vote at that time", Can they change the way we vote, time we vote and gather votes door to door, and how do we know vote is valid? YES, THEY CAN VISIT HOMEOWNERS AND TRY TO CONVINCE THEM ON A ONE TO ONE BASIS. THAT'S CALLED CAMPAIGNING. BUT THEY CAN NOT GATHER THE OFFICIAL VOTE AT THAT TIME. THE VOTE WILL HAVE TO COME AT A DULY CALLED MEETING OR HOW IT IS STATED IN YOUR DOCUMENTS.

3. We live on a canal and some residents have covered boat wells, boat houses etc., can they add updates or restrictions to deny homeowners from building new ones, maintaining old ones, and force the removal of existing structures based on the boards decision to do so. Do owners have any rights that would grandfather these structures or any state or government laws (DNR) that would override the HOA boards desicions. I ALWAYS UNDERSTOOD THAT THE DNR HAS JURISDICTION OVER SURFACE WATER, SO THE HOA HAS POWER ONLY ON PROPERTY THAT IT OWNS OR IS COVERED IN THE CCRS. IF STRUCTURES ARE BEING BUILT THAT ARE PROHIBITED IN THE CCRS, THEN THEY COULD ASK FOR THEIR REMOVAL. GRANDFATHERING GETS COMPLICATED, SINCE IT'S A KIND OF "EVERYONE BUT ME" MENTALITY.

JackJ4 (Michigan)
Posts: 2

Posted:

THE BOARD MUST FOLLOW THE BYLAWS OR CCRS FOR THE PROCEDURE FOR AMENDING THEM.

1. Is there any restrictions on how much or how often they can be re introduced and voted on. Can the BOD refuse to let members address these proposed ammendments at meetings, or deny members to ask questions. NO, BUT YU NEED TO ASK FOR A MOTION FOR THE BOARD TO SET ANOTHER MEETING FOR THE SOLE PURPOSE OF DISCUSSING THESE PROPOSED AMENDMENTS. ASK FOR AN INFORMATION GATHERING, A TOWN MEETING OR COMMITTEE MEETING.

How do I go about making this request and do you know if this applies in Michigan? Can it be requested by phone, or in writing, e-mail? What are my options if they do not respond or deny this?

2. Can the Board present "highlight summaries of proposed Covenant revisions on a door to door basis, as well as asking for a vote at that time", Can they change the way we vote, time we vote and gather votes door to door, and how do we know vote is valid? YES, THEY CAN VISIT HOMEOWNERS AND TRY TO CONVINCE THEM ON A ONE TO ONE BASIS. THAT'S CALLED CAMPAIGNING. BUT THEY CAN NOT GATHER THE OFFICIAL VOTE AT THAT TIME. THE VOTE WILL HAVE TO COME AT A DULY CALLED MEETING OR HOW IT IS STATED IN YOUR DOCUMENTS.

They state the month meeting will take place, a meeting of lot owners shall be held (march) yearly, at which...
shall be decided by the majority of the vote of lot owners.

3. We live on a canal and some residents have covered boat wells, boat houses etc., can they add updates or restrictions to deny homeowners from building new ones, maintaining old ones, and force the removal of existing structures based on the boards decision to do so. Do owners have any rights that would grandfather these structures or any state or government laws (DNR) that would override the HOA boards desicions. I ALWAYS UNDERSTOOD THAT THE DNR HAS JURISDICTION OVER SURFACE WATER, SO THE HOA HAS POWER ONLY ON PROPERTY THAT IT OWNS OR IS COVERED IN THE CCRS. IF STRUCTURES ARE BEING BUILT THAT ARE PROHIBITED IN THE CCRS, THEN THEY COULD ASK FOR THEIR REMOVAL. GRANDFATHERING GETS COMPLICATED, SINCE IT'S A KIND OF "EVERYONE BUT ME" MENTALITY.

Thank you for your input on grandfathering, very well put. My intent is not everyone but me and do not want to even head in that direction. My concern is with the new covenants all homeowners will lose the right to own or build a structure of this type. The majority of owners do not realize that adopting this new covenant will take away their right to build or repair an existing one, if they desire to build or repair one. Another concern is that people do not realize by adopting this covenant they are losing this right, because they are not aware they even have it, and it will have a huge impact on residents that want to repair or build a new structure.

Thank you so much for your reply I am new to this and am not sure if I dare to even continue, not sure what I may be getting myself into. I just feel that if I do not try to get answers and try to educate myself and others we will be led into situations and covenants that are not acceptable for our members.

Any suggestions on what to do or where to get information will be appreciated and used. thanks so much.

Subject: ccr chang