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DarcyC (Florida)
Posts: 30
Posted:
For our annual meting and election of the board we have the following procedure. At least 35 days in advance we contact all members of the association informing them of the election and ask for candidates for the board. We post a sign at the entrance with the same info. We have a three-member board. According to our by-laws member can vote in person or by proxy, and nominations can also be taken from the floor the night of the meeting and election. We usually only have 3 members willing to volunteer and they remain the same year after year. When we send out the meeting notice and proxy form we give all of these choices: Members can use the proxy form for quorum purpose only and not vote period. They can give it to the secretary to vote for them, they can give it to another member to vote for them or they can cast their vote on the proxy by voting for one of the candidates listed on the proxy form. They can also write in some one else or themselves or vote in person at the meeting. Is there anything illegal or unfair about this procedure. The question has been raised that by putting the names of the candidates on the proxy it gives them more of an advantage than someone waiting until the night of the meeting and being nominated from the floor. Our answer to that is then don’t wait, make sure you get your name on there as a candidate if you really want a position. Not that anyone does, we have 3 positions 3 candidates, the same ones, year after year. We are small community 35 homes but we do a lot of unnecessary work because a couple of troublemakers always question our procedures and have had to redo the whole election with the same outcome. I think we should just ignore them, or let them take a position on the board, which they won’t do. Your thoughts please?
MichaelM6 (Georgia)
Posts: 6
Posted:
DarcyC:

Your procedures look OK to me. What is the true purpose of the "troublemaker"'s questions? If it is truly to make trouble, the board chairman can rule them out of order and move on with the election or normal business. The board should be sure of the procedures, make sure they're legit and in line with Roberts' Rules. Your troublemaker should get a copy ($5) so they don't have any procedures issues to keep you annoyed. The chairman can ask the troublemaker if they've bothered to read up on Roberts Rules, and when they haven't...gong! Never ignore them, that's bad manners and bad procedure. At least they show up!

Michael
44 units in GA
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Darcy, I would suggest you not put names of candidates on the proxy when you are accepting nominations from the floor. It does give those persons an unfair advantage over anyone nominated from the floor.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Roger, then how are the people who do not attend supposed to vote? If for whatever reason you can’t attend the meeting and wish them to have your proxy so the can have the meeting but you want to vote for the candidate of your choice. In the past our association has used a directed proxy ballot similar to the one Darcy described.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Yes Glen, a directed proxy can be used but I would prefer advising your proxy as to whom you want them to vote under various conditions which may come up at the meeting. Otherwise I would use an absentee ballot.
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
Proxy: a form which transfers complete voting power from one person to another.

absentee ballot: a form which allows a person to exercise their own vote.

they are two different things. An absentee ballot must have the names of all candidates on it (in arizona, at least), so no nominations from the floor can be taken. A proxy needs no names or nominations, because in fact, the proxy holder can vote however they choose (ie, they do not actually have to cast the vote the way the original owner wished. The bearer of the proxy owns all the rights to cast votes in the place of the giver).

SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302
Posted:
Is it ok for a Board member to canvas the neighborhood to collect proxies and then use them to win an election or to place a friend on the Board? Our secretary said she got the honor of filling in the proxies and she did.
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
can anyone ask for and collect proxies? yes. it's up to the giver to decide who they trust with them, and if they trust anyone who asks, then they help elect whoever that person wanted.

as for "filling them in", that depends on what you mean. No one except the giver can fill in a proxy... and a blank proxy is a scrap of note paper, that's all. Unless the giver fills it out, and signs it, it isn't valid as a proxy. To do otherwise would mean someone could print blank proxies, and generate them in situ.. totally illegal.
SidneyP (Florida)
Posts: 302
Posted:
Thanks, Brian. The proxies were filled out and signed just who they were voting for was left blank. The secretary fill that in w/her name and her neighbor the President. She said the CC&R's gave her the authority to complete the proxies. Ok, suppose I want to be President, can I go to my neighbors and ask for their proxy, then write my name in, then turn them in at the election meeting?
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
more or less, yes.

DarcyC (Florida)
Posts: 30
Posted:
Roger,
We do not actually have names but they can write in if they choose.

OTTER TRACE HOMEOWNERS ASSOCIATION
PROXY
FOR THE ELECTION OF BOARD OF DIRECTORS

I hereby authorize the following assignment of this proxy
(PLEASE PLACE AN "X" IN ONE BOX ONLY):

_____ I DECLINE TO VOTE; THIS PROXY IS TO BE USED FOR QUORUM PURPOSES ONLY.

_____ I DESIGNATE THE PRESIDENT/SECRETARY TO VOTE THIS PROXY AS DIRECTED BY THE
CURRENT BOARD.

_____ I HAVE CAST MY VOTES AS A WRITE-IN AS INDICATED BELOW.

_____ I HEREBY GRANT _____________________________________ TO VOTE ON MY BEHALF.
(Print the name of the Otter Trace homeowner you wish to vote on your behalf. This person must be present at the meeting to register your vote.)

This will be valid for the Otter Trace Homeowner's Association meeting that will
be held on 11/20/2006 (date of scheduled meeting).

If I am present at this meeting, I reserve the right to retrieve this proxy and vote on my own behalf.

Owner’s Signature Please Print Name Date

Address Lot #

********************************************************************************

Write-In Candidates

 You are entitled to cast a total of three (3) votes.
 If the number exceeds three (3), this ballot will be considered invalid.
 Please write the total number of votes cast for a specific candidate in the space to the right of the candidate's name.
 Note that nominations will also be welcomed from the floor during the Annual Meeting.

Homeowner Write-In Candidate (Please Print Name) Total # of Votes

________________________________________ ______________

________________________________________ ______________

DarcyC (Florida)
Posts: 30
Posted:
Roger, Thanks for the reply. It just seems that if a person in running for office he or she would be foolish not to campaign or have their name on some kind of ballot so everyone knows who they are. Unless they have something to hide. Which did happen just recently. A lot of the members want to avoid having to go through another recall and requested we fine tune the process so everything is done out in the open. I understand we must still take floor nominations and that person is at a disadvantage, by their own doing. There are three members who are objecting and about 31 who approve of our process. Either way my answer to anyone who thinks an election is unfair or illegal can take it to election dispute as required by the Fl. Statutes. We have done everything in good faith giving everyone a fair chance if they are willing to take it. We still only have three canidates for three positions so it seems like a moot point.
Regards
Darcy
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Darcy, point well taken. The flip side is this method can be used by the Board to bias the voting to their choices. This happens when potential candidates have no advance warning so do not have an opportunity to add their name for consideration.
DarcyC (Florida)
Posts: 30
Posted:
Roger, I can understand how that that would be a problem if a board failed to give everyone an equal opportunity well in advance. It would be hard to vote a board out, but in our case we actually go begging for volunteers.
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
additional note:
some states (like arizona) have outlawed proxy voting.
DarcyC (Florida)
Posts: 30
Posted:
Well I think here in Florida they like to keep everything ambiguous as possible. That way everything is open to litigation. Our Fl, Statutes only state that Elections of directors must be in accordance with the procedures set forth in the governing documents. All members shall be eligible to serve on the board and a member MAY nominate themselves as a candidate for the board at a meeting where an election is to be held. Any election dispute must be submitted to mandatory binding arbitration with the division. It also states members have a right to vote in person or by proxy unless prohibited in the by-laws. Our by-laws say the same, Member may vote in person or by proxy. I think mailing out a ballot along with the proxy is probably valid also. We have had a lot of dishonesty with proxies and would like to do away with them all together at least for elections. I don’t know what it is about Florida but people cannot get their act together when it comes to any kind of election.
LindaC3 (Florida)
Posts: 526
Posted:
I did a search of the forum so decided to add to this posting instead of creating a new thread... I need some assistance with the verbage on our proxies that were mailed to us for our upcoming election.At our last BOD meeting 12-10-06 the question of SUB PROXIES was brought up--- The following verbage is on our Proxies.....

The undersigned hereby appoints as his/her proxy, with the power of substitution,

Jane Doe to vote on the following matters :

Does the "with the power of substitution" lend itself to imply that the appointed proxy person may then allow a substitute for the proxy given to Jane Doe ? Thanks for any input Linda C

BELOW IS THE WORDING FROM FLA STATE STATUTES REGARDING PROXIES

8) PROXY VOTING.--The members have the right, unless otherwise provided in this subsection or in the governing documents, to vote in person or by proxy. To be valid, a proxy must be dated, must state the date, time, and place of the meeting for which it was given, and must be signed by the authorized person who executed the proxy. A proxy is effective only for the specific meeting for which it was originally given, as the meeting may lawfully be adjourned and reconvened from time to time, and automatically expires 90 days after the date of the meeting for which it was originally given. A proxy is revocable at any time at the pleasure of the person who executes it.

------- If the proxy form expressly so provides, any proxy holder may appoint, in writing, a substitute to act in his or her place.------
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Linda, the answer is yes to your question on a proxy with power of substitution.

That explains the Florida statute provision:
--- If the proxy form expressly so provides, any proxy holder may appoint, in writing, a substitute to act in his or her place ---
TomS2 (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
You have to check your bylaws to determine if the election is by a vote of the members. A vote is a "live" event that occurs at a meeting, it is NOT filled out ahead of time. A proxy allows the person to stand in your shows and vote the way the Proxy desires. The proxy is under no obligation to vote the way a member would prefer. That is why one should be careful who one appoints as a proxy.

BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
excellent point tom, one i always try to remind folks of. and, as shown here, your proxy can pass on your vote to another proxy, in some cases, so you lose even more control.

LindaC3 (Florida)
Posts: 526
Posted:
All excellent replies - Thank you so much--- As we draw closer to Our Annual Membership meeting I have been approached by a few Members to create a letter to those who have chosen to send proxies in lieu of physically attending the meeting.. I am running for the BOD this year and have been quite active at the BOD meetings,I have taken the suggested "proactive " member approach and it has been quite successful.Thank you group for all your advice in that regards...Now I need some addtional help with creating this letter to explain the pros and cons of proxies....Any suggestions would be most appreciated.........Thanks Bunches LindaC

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