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PatrickD1 (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 3
Posted:
I live in Pennsylvania, and im an active board member
1- Can the state of pa give a variance to a homeowner who wants to raise chickens in a private residential community?
2-A coup has been built under the premise of being a playhouse for her handicapped child.
(Without prior permission from the board, also no plans ,elevations or location have been filed with the board since it is a large structure which also has electricity installed and a fenced in area attached to the rear)

Our covenants read as the following

3. Any building erected on the premises shall be subject to all governmental regulations relative to construction in addition to the covenants its, easements, reservations, charges and conditions.

2. No building, structure, or fences shall be erected upon the premises hereby conveyed without first obtaining the approval, in writing, of the grantor, as to location elevation, plan and design.
Any structure or construction must be completed within twelve months after same is started

8. No animals shall be kept on any lot other than commonly accepted domestic pets
(most people accept this term as being cats and dogs)

This person just happens to be the previous board president of the past three years and obviously does what she wants.

There was a petition when this rumor was first heard of in the community and since our community is only 89 dwellings 17 ( a legal meeting quorum is 15) HOA members signed it saying that they do not want chickens in the community.

I don’t know how to proceed to get this under control and rid the area of chickens. Know this is going to turn into a legal situation

SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
Why is the state involved? Usually it's local municpality ordinances that govern things like this. What is the zoning of your HOA?

Around here, only small farm zoning can allow chickens.

In any case, your CCRs take precedent and yours do say "domestic pets." - so she could argue tht chickens are domestic pets.

Is she selling the eggs? How many chickens?

PS How did that "playhouse" get built anyway/

PatrickD1 (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 3
Posted:
Our zoning is low density residential as per the zoning map

As for the building, she was the president of the BOD at the time and I inquired about this structure prior to joining the BOD, the response was from previous board members was she just did it.
There was no request on record to build this structure to the BOD at the time.
Also I like to mention that there were only three members of the board since 2 resigned their positions.

I don’t know how many chickens there are in this building, I understand the "domestic animals" is a broad term but most people assume its dogs or cats.

The state or municipality is involved by hearsay; the homeowner has stated that she has "permission" from the county or state.

In my personal opinion she is in violation on three counts base on what I wrote in my prior post. But my personal opinion does not count here.
SusanW1 (Michigan)
Posts: 5,202
Posted:
Call your local animal control and ask.

Then call the local municipality and request an inspection from am ordinance officer.

There's power in numbers. Do you have support from others in your community?
PatrickD1 (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 3
Posted:
Prior to my joining the board I circulated a petition against this action by the homeowner, it had at least 10 signatures (there could have been more but it was not pressed at the time) and was sent certified mail to the existing board.
Obviously it had no affect on any decisions that were made.
Being a board member now and reviewing past board business it also appears that it was not addressed by the BOD in any manner same as the building of the structure to house these animals.
Rumor has it that the homeowner was also getting a pet ion signed to allow this person to have chickens.
But again it would be a change or variance in the covenants and they would need a majority amount of signatures.
Since a pet ion was originally signed by homeowners against it based on the covenants , it would appear to me that the prior BOD did not act in the best interest of the community and just ignored the request of 10 homeowners
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 388
Posted:
Parick,

First of all this would not be a state issue, but rather a local one, either city (if you are w/i city limits) or county. You can check with code control to see if poultry are allowed in an area zoned residential. However, it doesn't even matter what the city/co allows, the HOA's CCRs can be more restrictive. Yours definitely say no animals except for domestic pets. All the BOD needs to do is make certain chickens are being raised on the property then issue a violation notice and give the prop owner x number of days/weeks to cure the violation. Be sure to indicate the two specific CCR articles that are being violated (#2 & #8 of your msg). If she doesn't then attach fines and if she still fails to cure the violation then take her to court. Board members should never be afraid to exercise their right to enforce the CCRs, after all that's what you were elected to do. It seems that the current board is afraid of this person simply because she is a past board Pres. As long as she knows this she will continue to do things w/o permission. BTW, petitions hold no weight unless the gov docs specifically state the BOD must comply with them.
MaryA1 (Arizona)
Posts: 388
Posted:
Patrick,

Sorry I misspelled your name. I'm still getting used to a new keyboard!
BrianB (California)
Posts: 2,820
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By PatrickD1 on 10/13/2010 3:26 AM
I live in Pennsylvania, and im an active board member
1- Can the state of pa give a variance to a homeowner who wants to raise chickens in a private residential community?
Our covenants read as the following
3. Any building erected on the premises shall be subject to all governmental regulations relative to construction in addition to the covenants its, easements, reservations, charges and conditions.

2. No building, structure, or fences shall be erected upon the premises hereby conveyed without first obtaining the approval, in writing, of the grantor, as to location elevation, plan and design.
Any structure or construction must be completed within twelve months after same is started

8. No animals shall be kept on any lot other than commonly accepted domestic pets
(most people accept this term as being cats and dogs)


1) Can the state give a variance? Yes, legally they can. However, I honestly doubt that they have. I bet 1)the owner is simply tossing this excuse out there with no backing or 2) the "state" (ie, some clerk at the end of a telephone) answered a generic question about chicken raising that has been construed as an answer.

I can see that your owner has likely violated article 2 (no building without approval), probably violated article 3 (assuming you have some covenants in place about reviews, designs, approval, etc). It's a toss up on article 8, because of the wording.

Domestic pets are pets held domestically (in the US). Domesticated pets are animals thought by biologists to have been domesticated by man over the millenia, held as pets. Dogs are the leading example of that. Cats, another typical example, although their domestication is subject to some debate. Most fowl, while you might argue domestication, are not always considered "pets", but that definition varies by area of the country. I don't consider pigeons to be pets, but back east, some folks do. In the midwest, cattle are sometimes considered pets. Or, as a farmer i knew once told me, "a Pig is pet. A hog is just delicious."
DennisT (Ohio)
Posts: 109
Posted:
Short story about claiming a handicap as an excuse for violating the rules. We had a woman come to a board meeting wanting to put a grill on her second floor balcony which violates the state fire code for multi-family dwellings (i.e. condos).

Her: Hi. My name is Donna Smith. My father has cerebral palsy and my daughter is mentally handicapped. I would like to put a gas grill on my balcony.
Me (as President): Nice to meet you Ms. Smith. The Board cannot allow gas grills on the second floor balconies because it's a state fire code issue. It's out of our hands.
Her: Well, my daughter is mentally handicapped and my father can't walk because he has the palsy. So I think it should be allowed.
Me: Unfortunately we have no control over the state fire code. You're welcome to try calling the fire marshal.

*Next meeting*

Her: Hi. My father has cerebral palsy and my daughter is mentally handicapped. I called the fire marshal and he said I can do whatever I want in a private residence although he didn't recommend putting a grill on my balcony.
Me: Did you explain that you lived in a condo with 16 living units in your building?
Her: No, I didn't think that was important.
Me: Well call them back and be sure to explain that little detail and let us know at the next meeting.

Never heard from her again.

Point being yes it's unfortunate that there are handicapped people out there and yes the ADA requires reasonable accommodations to be made but make sure that the fact that someone is handicapped is even remotely relevant to what's being requested. If nobody else is allowed to have a playhouse I can't see how you could be required to allow a handicapped child to have one. On the other hand if others did have playhouses you couldn't prohibit her from putting a ramp on the entrance to hers. I would pretend you didn't hear her say that her child was handicapped because in this context I really don't think it's relevant. If she wants to press the case for an ADA accommodation let her take that step. Otherwise leave the handicapped child out of it and deal with it as you are - an unauthorized structure and an animal violation.

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